CBUB Changes For Consideration

[Fox]

Hi All

 

I am thinking I will probably redesign the CBUB.  Besides just a website "Look and Feel" redesign, also a fundamental change of what the CBUB "game" is.

 

So the CBUB is a place to post a rumble about who can beat who, which is cool.  But there are also the "Rated Matches" which is the basis of the CBUB "game".  In the CBUB game users write a match and then get graded kind of like they are in school.

 

It is the CBUB "game" I'm considering replacing.  And there's a few reasons I can give for why I think it has had its day.  (I'm not talking about the Monthly Tournament, just the day to day "game" thing, BTW).

 

First off, in the entertainment sense of being a "game" it is kind of more like "work".  Users create ever more elaborate scenarios for an audience of a couple of judges who then read them and grade them like they are school papers.

 

How one wins at this "game" is kind of nebulous.  I mean, I guess you win when you are an "A" student.

 

The barrier to entry is really high. That is, the kind of new person who would dig on that kind of "game" seems few and far between.  And also, the kind of writing skills the judges look for takes time to develop and is uncommon in younger people.  And lets face it, a website about superheroes probably is going to have a high ratio of young visitors. 

 

And every now and then when a new guy does post a match what often follows is a couple quick posts telling them why their match or writing sucks.  That's probably not much fun for them in the "game" sense.

 

Lastly, it's evolved into something which the original CBUB was not.  The CBUB was meant to be light and airy - easy to digest like a bag of Doritos.  Just a place to discuss who could beat who.  It wasn't originally intended to morph into an esoteric creative writing game which it did.

 

Anyways, so that's my feeling on it and I think I'm going to be changing what the CBUB "game" is.  You know, the thing people play for fun.  I want to make something that is more... accessible.

 

So here's what I'm thinking I am going to make.

 

A game where players create their own Team of characters out of the database (maybe 5-7 to a team).  Matches occur within the pool of characters selected for all teams.  Winning a match with one of your team characters gets your team points.  The matches occur for a length of time which is a "Season".  Let's say a "Season" is a couple months.  The player whose Team has the highest points wins the season.

 

These matches wouldn't require any more set-up than a Rumble.  That is, the writing talent of the player is not on trial.  Possibly, a script will create the match-ups between the characters in the pool.

 

Anyways, so that's what I'm thinking.  Some game with less barriers to entry, still interesting in that you choose your team at the start of the season and see how they do.  And still a place to kick around "who wins" as the match-ups occur.

 

Something new and CBUB like.  Any thoughts?

[patrickthekid]

Honestly, my biggest beef with the new system is not being able to rate a match without voting for it. It may be decent way to ensure that there are no extra votes, but it becomes detrimental if you don't know who to vote for. This is especially hurting people (like yours truly) why uses obsure characters... only to see the match scratched because no one has a clue who to vote for and cannot rate without it.

 

I would recommend matches like that to be turned into a sudden death style in which the next amount of votes in 24 hours determine a winner or requiring at least one judge to rate.

 

Oh, and CBUB Issues need to return, Serge plz.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

This new system sounds interesting. Could help bring new members in.

 

I'm also all for the return of the Match Issues. Hell, I'd even be willing to help co-write/commentate some of 'em, with others' help of course.

[Fox]

Guys, doing the weekly match is a lot of work.  I mean *a lot* of work.  Like I spent every weekend - the whole weekend - doing them for the years I did them.

 

Other people have given it a go from time to time.  They are very quickly like "holy shit, that's a lot of work".  It's just not sustainable.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

I can imagine it'd be tedious, but surely if a group of people chipped in it would lessen the workload? Though come to think of it, the weekly format sounds pretty tough. Did you ever consider switching it to monthly?

[RakaiThwei]

Guys, doing the weekly match is a lot of work.  I mean *a lot* of work.  Like I spent every weekend - the whole weekend - doing them for the years I did them.

 

Other people have given it a go from time to time.  They are very quickly like "holy shit, that's a lot of work".  It's just not sustainable.

 

 

I agree with this as a former CBUB Match writer.

 

Writing up matches is a lot harder to do than one thinks, especially if there was a match limit of three to five days. Not only do you have to figure out who is going to be in the next match up, you have to figure out the location, who is likely to be in that location and exactly how and why things go down the way that they do.

 

If Serge doesn't want to bring back the weekly issues, then it's his God given right not to do it.

 

On the new CBUB Match system well.... It does sound interesting, I'll give it that.

 

Gives us a chance to really make our own Justice League or Avengers rosters and pretend they are legit.

 

-Rakai'Thwei

[Fox]

I can imagine it'd be tedious, but surely if a group of people chipped in it would lessen the workload? Though come to think of it, the weekly format sounds pretty tough. Did you ever consider switching it to monthly?

 

Tried that, yep.  The weekly format is a hard deadline to get people to commit to.  Don't get me wrong, everyone has the best intentions going in, but it's a hard grind for gentle slackers.

 

The Monthly format is poor.  Done that a couple times.  So did Grudge Match.  They decided it sucked and so did I.  The mob demands fresh blood in the arena each week, if you want to keep your visitors.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

I agree with this as a former CBUB Match writer.

 

Writing up matches is a lot harder to do than one thinks, especially if there was a match limit of three to five days. Not only do you have to figure out who is going to be in the next match up, you have to figure out the location, who is likely to be in that location and exactly how and why things go down the way that they do.

 

Yeah, I know how difficult writing matches can be, but keep in mind the Issues as shown in the back issues catalogue are very, very different.

 

 

 

Tried that, yep.  The weekly format is a hard deadline to get people to commit to.  Don't get me wrong, everyone has the best intentions going in, but it's a hard grind for gentle slackers.

 

The Monthly format is poor.  Done that a couple times.  So did Grudge Match.  They decided it sucked and so did I.  The mob demands fresh blood in the arena each week, if you want to keep your visitors.

 

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwww!

[Guest bigballerju]

People already love making threads on creating your teams. If CBUB finally got it's own version of fantasy draft where you create your own team and they face off that would be great. Weekly matches mean people have to rush and meet deadlines. A lot of good writers here like to take their time to do excellent setups. Though I do wish we could add more matches to the CBUB Back Issues.

[Fox]

Glad to see the idea of replacing the school grade game with a "fantasy draft" game is generally positive.  Guess I'll run this over to the general discussion area for comments..

[AVP vs The Terminator]

But yeah, I'm all for the change in the system. Change is good every once in a while.

[Bergy_Berg]

Sounds pretty cool. Would teams be classified in different tiers? Because I'd hate to try to find a team of cosmic characters to compete with.

[Guest sithisson]

I like the idea of the teams as well as I've been working on trying to make some sort of LGX sort of team with little results so far. Either I can't come up with a situation for a few of the try-outs, some of them are so out there I'm not sure if they'd even be well known, for people to vote the characters themselves fairly or I just get into a rut. This team idea might be the sort of thing that can help with that. I'd use whatever individual wins/losses  of each team  member per season of my team to create the tenured sort I was looking for.This way too it would bring positive results on all ends of the spectrum.

[Fox]

Sounds pretty cool. Would teams be classified in different tiers? Because I'd hate to try to find a team of cosmic characters to compete with.

 

Well, there's a couple ways to go with it, I think.

 

Option A I call the "Squirrel Girl Option".  That is, Squirrel Girl looks silly but has managed to beat Deadpool, Terrax, Thanos, Dr. Doom, Ego The Living Planet, etc.  Using this option players are left to draft whatever character they want and it's up to the players to kick around if a less powerful opponent can beat the Gokus and Supermans.

 

Option B I call the "Team Slot Option".  That is, each season the players would have to fill slots decided for the season's run.  Team slots could be anything, really.  Like, you have to have one "Cosmic Being", one entry from the "Toons" category, one "Spaceship", etc.  Whatever is decided makes up a team of 7.  When players draft the teams it would be up to Referees (probably the current CBUB Match Judges) to determine if the slots are are filled by a player in keeping with the spirit of the Season's slots.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

I like option B. Leaves plenty of room for versatility.

[leroypowell3]

Okay... I agree something has to be done to make this wonderful site more accessable to visitors and new members but stupid question time...

 

Are we still doing matches?

 

Will there still be a divide between matches and rumbles?

 

Will these teams (claimed for an entire season) be gobble up so that others's can't use them?

 

How will character's usage and win loss records be effected?

 

Sorry, I'm just trying to wrap my head around this?

[corvette1710]

What sorcery is this? A CHANGE?!

 

Cool beans. I'm up for Option B as well.

[Fox]

Okay... I agree something has to be done to make this wonderful site more accessable to visitors and new members but stupid question time...

 

Are we still doing matches?

 

Will there still be a divide between matches and rumbles?

 

Will these teams (claimed for an entire season) be gobble up so that others's can't use them?

 

How will character's usage and win loss records be effected?

 

Sorry, I'm just trying to wrap my head around this?

 

Sure you can still do matches.  Why not?  The divide will be the Match Board will be for peoples Season Team matches and Rumbles is still the do whatever you want board.  The "fantasy draft" team characters people pick for their teams can be used on the Rumble board, sure.  And of course a set-up for a rumble match can be as long as you wish.

 

> How will character's usage and win loss records be effected?

 

Possibly I would reset them and start over.  Then just use the win/loss stats from the "fantasy draft" matches which ensue (not rumble board matches) on an ongoing basis. 

 

I mean, I don't know how married to the current win/loss record of the existing characters people are.  I just thought it would be more... er... official-like and interesting if the win/loss stats of characters reflected how they did Season to Season on an ongoing basis.

[Guest Dr. Pymp(mex)]

Good topic

 

I would personally like to see where Judges pick a fight (1 vs 1 or etc) and then post it like it used to be

http://www.electricferret.com/fights/issue_156.htm

 

If you( CBUB) is worried about it being too much work, then maybe have a set up already written; judges could pick people from the database that aren't used as much to get more of a variance instead of Goku vs Superman (I know I am a DBZ nerd) This would also give an insight to new characters that are unknown and promote them more. (Remember we are here to promote comics and animes etc so people can be aware

 

Then "we" the peons can comment on it and it would eliminate the need to saythings like (your writing sucks) or you need to spell correctly.

 

Making this fun would be a great idea, as I have been on CBUB for a few years now and have noticed a declined in quality(not in the site, but the people)

 

So to recap

 

1. Have the matches lined up so the people can vote etc.

2. Make it so if you want to write a set up that it meets certain standards like min words needed to post it, or have some sort of spell check installed (that is easy to do) and make that a separate option (like EF is now)

3. Make a torunament style arrangement, include brackets like round 1 has 16 people, round two has 8, round three 4 and then the finals.

4. Make it FUN. not so nerdy and technical.

 

Lets face it, comics are for kids, us adults still love them as we were kids, but as kids we would never say, "youre dumb for thinking so and so would beat up so and so" We would talk about it and move on, we wouldn't have "I'm so tired of this match up" or "this has been done a million times" without those this site would be lame in my opinion.

 

Food for thought.

[DSkillz]

Wow, these potential changes are certainly something to think over. I've been reading things through throughout the day, and many of the questions I would've had have pretty much either been answered or are being considered.

 

One thing about characters' win/loss records, though: While for various reasons, I could personally pretty much care less about them, there are some members that spent long stretches seriously (or not so much, heh) building these characters up, occasionally to the point of them making the CBUB Top Contenders' List. I'm not sure how many of those members are still attached to those characters and/or their records, but this may be something else to think about. 

 

With the grade system possibly being purged, it also needs to be discussed how new CBUB Match Judges will be chosen. 

[Guest sithisson]

In terms of the team options I think B sounds good. It''ll give a lot of ways to play it out in terms of team build and methods to the madness of match making.

[Fox]

One thing about characters' win/loss records, though: While for various reasons, I could personally pretty much care less about them, there are some members that spent long stretches seriously (or not so much, heh) building these characters up, occasionally to the point of them making the CBUB Top Contenders' List. I'm not sure how many of those members are still attached to those characters and/or their records, but this may be something else to think about.

 

Oh, I see.  Yeah, well, I don't want to piss anybody off.  I think I've fulfilled my quota of that for awhile.

 

I'll just have to do something like put in separate "season" win/loss records I guess.

[xLEGACYx]

I like the idea of making teams.  Its sounds like a fresh and exciting way to bring in more members.  Its also becomes more of a competitive game that way.

 

As for the Grudge Matches that AVP was suggesting, a possible idea would be to let anyone submit detailed set-ups and have the admins collect the best and put out one a week.  Then if no new ones come in they would still have some on reserve.  Its just an idea.  Set a set minimum number of words it has to be.  Just an idea.  

 

I always enjoyed the two announcers setting up the fight ala Celebrity Deathmatch style.

[Fox]

Alright well, I haven't really heard anyone say...

 

"Fox, No, that sucks, it's a terrible terrible idea, DO NOT GO THERE"

 

So, I guess I'm gonna do that.  You can probably expect some CBUB downtime over the next few weeks while I make the changes.

[Culwych1]

Hey Fox, 

 

The changes do sound good, the only process issue I can see will be 'moderating' the Team Slot Option within the site. As Bergy_Berg pointed out, you just know there's going to be someone who goes against the grain and chooses a team of Cosmics anyway, or even a few people who just get it wrong. Making sure this is fair is always going to be the hardest point in this game. 

 

However, I completely am on board for a change - I've been meaning to suggest something for a while based on another thread that was kicking around here for a while about merging the Rumbles with the official matches. Whilst there are a few people here who write for the enjoyment of writing, that's not really what the CBUB was all those years ago and the criticism of new writers and their short setups does probably lose more visitors than it attracts. 

 

As long as the monthly challenge still stands and we still see some good writing then I'm happy! Looking forward to seeing the magic happen