5:1 - Batman Beyond vs. X-23

[DSkillz]

8 hours ago, Peypeypeypey said:

Every single one of those feats was from the cartoon other than the Mach 19 feat.

Heh, that's right. That was a weird time for strength feats for street-level DCAU characters. In that same real-life period, Batman send KIller Croc flying across a factory room with a single punch in the modern timeline. Lol at Death Battle, though, for calculating that first feat at 100 + ton strength.

That Mach 19 feat from the comics, though, seems more like travel speed than combat speed.

[Peypeypeypey]

11 minutes ago, DSkillz said:

Heh, that's right. That was a weird time for strength feats for street-level DCAU characters. In that same real-life period, Batman send KIller Croc flying across a factory room with a single punch in the modern timeline. Lol at Death Battle, though, for calculating that first feat at 100 + ton strength.

That Mach 19 feat from the comics, though, seems more like travel speed than combat speed.

Yeah, DB's calculation for that boulder feat was way off the mark. However, it is undeniably at least 50 tons. And unlike feats such as "He can kick a solid rock monster several feet into the air," there is 0 ambiguity here. He's not lifting with any amps, he's not getting any help, he's not shoving some debris off of himself to make the load lighter, he's unambiguously, 100% lifting a 50+ ton object off the ground and hoisting it above himself.

The Mach 19 is movement speed, but it's also way above what I would consider innate street tier movement speeds

[Fox]

I didn't look into Batman Beyond as deeply as I should have.  I just did not remember him being that strong.

Comic Vine lists his specs of his suit as "Increases the wearer's strength by a factor of 10".  Depending on what his natural strength is, that could put him over 2 tons.

VS Battle Wiki puts him at able to lift a tank... so that is definitely over. 

I would say people should bring this up before the season starts - check out the other teams and post concerns.

My bad.

 

[DSkillz]

Curiously, though, even with those feats, Terry was fairly often beaten down by normal humans. Take that as you will.

[SSJRuss]

7 minutes ago, DSkillz said:

Curiously, though, even with those feats, Terry was fairly often beaten down by normal humans. Take that as you will.

Agreed. No matter where you stand, comic book characters will always have inconsistencies. Terry is no exception.

Not looking at his crazy feats, I still feel that he would win this match more consistently than X-23

[Confession FPT]

X-23 every night of the week and twice on Sundays. 

[Peypeypeypey]

1 hour ago, DSkillz said:

Curiously, though, even with those feats, Terry was fairly often beaten down by normal humans. Take that as you will.

I feel like Terry is roughly Spiderman level. He can be beaten by regular (peak) humans, but his powers put him well above the category limits

[C.T.]

3 hours ago, SSJRuss said:

Agreed. No matter where you stand, comic book characters will always have inconsistencies. Terry is no exception.

Not looking at his crazy feats, I still feel that he would win this match more consistently than X-23

I’d say the other way around.

[Bergy_Berg]

2 hours ago, Peypeypeypey said:

I feel like Terry is roughly Spiderman level. He can be beaten by regular (peak) humans, but his powers put him well above the category limits

I just don't agree with that viewpoint. I think Batman Beyond is really meant to be a step down from the power level of a Spiderman. There are funky feats, sure, but at the end of the day he's not Spiderman.

Also he wins this match

[Peypeypeypey]

23 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

I just don't agree with that viewpoint. I think Batman Beyond is really meant to be a step down from the power level of a Spiderman. There are funky feats, sure, but at the end of the day he's not Spiderman.

Also he wins this match

You can disagree all you want, but he is clearly above street tier and clearly too powerful for this category

[Bergy_Berg]

19 minutes ago, Peypeypeypey said:

You can disagree all you want, but he is clearly above street tier and clearly too powerful for this category

We can probably also throw out Batman and Captain America then. Kamala Khan can go too.

[Peypeypeypey]

6 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

We can probably also throw out Batman and Captain America then. Kamala Khan can go too.

I have no idea about Kamala Khan, but the literal point of Batman Beyond is that he is physically superior to Batman in every way. He's far stronger, far faster, and far more durable. That was the conceit of the show. Batman has occasional showings that push the borders of the category, sure, but Beyond has a ton of feats that outright obliterate it. Again, he lifted a boulder that is generously estimated at 70 tons. Batman can lift a lot, but I have never seen any canonical Batman feat that shows him lifting that much weight without a lot of context to the scene to justify it. And Beyond is consistently shown to be that strong. It's not a one-off thing. He's supposed to be far stronger than Batman. 

[SSJRuss]

I don't think it does us any good to discuss if he should be in the draft at this point. Beyond is stronger than Batman because of the armor. Can he dead-lift 2 tons? Maybe. But strength isn't really a matter here. He's not going to drop a boulder or tank on X-23 in the middle of New York City. He wins because of his superior intellect, mobility, skills and gear. Can X-23 kill him? Absolutely. She could stab right through that armor. But I just don't see it going down that way.

[C.T.]

2 minutes ago, SSJRuss said:

I don't think it does us any good to discuss if he should be in the draft at this point. Beyond is stronger than Batman because of the armor. Can he dead-lift 2 tons? Maybe. But strength isn't really a matter here. He's not going to drop a boulder or tank on X-23 in the middle of New York City. He wins because of his superior intellect, mobility, skills and gear. Can X-23 kill him? Absolutely. She could stab right through that armor. But I just don't see it going down that way.

His gear is definitely superior, and that gives him greater mobility, yeah. Intellect I'm not sure about, think that's debatable. And superior in skill, I doubt that honestly. She's more skilled than Wolverine and acknowledged by Black Widow as one of the best in combat. If he gets in close, that would go her way IMO. I feel none of his ranged arsenal would manage to put her down, so I feel at some point he'd have to try using his superior strength up close like that. In that respect I don't see Terry as managing to pull it off. The hits when they land would definitely hurt like hell but that's nothing she hasn't endured, could potentially even catch him off guard with her footclaws. She did so brilliantly against Taskmaster(awesome moment but that's neither here nor there) and as I said in an earlier post, I feel he'd just be delaying the inevitable. 

However the votes go is just the way it is though, and either way I really liked this match just like most of the other mid-tier hero battles. : ) 

[Nate86]

I think this match is close but X-23 is gonna edge out ahead for me. Like a few people have said, Terry will have to come in close and when he does I don’t see him outmaneuvering her at hand to hand and she’ll get in one or two good slashes. At that point I see him retreating and losing blood, Bruce has to find him passed out on a Gotham rooftop and nurse him back to health. This is just the main scenario I’ve been coming back to in my head anyway.

[DSkillz]

I think Laura should likely win this, too. On top of everything else mentioned, she's also had a lot more combat training than Terry. Terry hasn't quite faced someone like X-23.

[Bergy_Berg]

I feel like people are underselling the durability of the suit. It's shown on multiple occasions to be able to stop slashing and piercing attacks that can cut through metal.

The suit will more than protect Terry long enough for him to realize the danger and get distance before reengaging with a plan.

[Macklemore]

3 minutes ago, Bergy_Berg said:

I feel like people are underselling the durability of the suit. It's shown on multiple occasions to be able to stop slashing and piercing attacks that can cut through metal.

The suit will more than protect Terry long enough for him to realize the danger and get distance before reengaging with a plan.

I fail to see why it would stop Adamantium. Unless Terry has no sold Promethium before, the DC equivalent of Adamantium, I refuse to believe he can stop the slashing.

[Nate86]

Yeah, I’d say if Terry were a Marvel character he could account for adamantium but being from DC he hasn’t gone up against it. It’s that paired with X-23 being superior in combat that gets me leaning towards her.

[Bergy_Berg]

31 minutes ago, Macklemore said:

I fail to see why it would stop Adamantium. Unless Terry has no sold Promethium before, the DC equivalent of Adamantium, I refuse to believe he can stop the slashing.

Because, despite Adamantium being super hard, it still requires a ton of force and a clean hit to get through Terry's Batsuit. He's gonna be moving out of the way of those shots, at best she'll land glancing blows. And when Terry realizes how dangerous they are he'll be staying out of their way.

Guy has been trained in martial arts by Batman himself and was a good fighter even before.

1 hour ago, DSkillz said:

I think Laura should likely win this, too. On top of everything else mentioned, she's also had a lot more combat training than Terry. Terry hasn't quite faced someone like X-23.

Debatable. He's faced a variety of powerful foes, it's not like adapting to this opponent will be more difficult than taking on the Terrific Trio.

[Peypeypeypey]

I haven't really commented on my opinion of the fight, but I also think Beyond should win. He's probably a little less fast and has slightly less experience, but he does have enough training and he's quick enough that she's not just going to be able to slice him up. His vast arsenal is also going to do wonders for him here. This electric attack is capable of chipping apart a robot said to be made of Promethium. He has a wide variety of sonic, electric, and gas-based weaponry that he can throw at her, and the environment means he would never really be in trouble. He can always just fly away and at his speeds there's no way in hell she'll ever catch him. As far as I can tell, she has no real recourse if he just stays out of range. Going by the logic of "Wolverine can lose via concussion, etc.," Beyond is definitely strong enough and has a wide enough arsenal to concuss her and get a win. If it were in close quarters I would agree that he's in trouble, but this setting makes it trivial for him to stay safe indefinitely and pelt her with weapons until something sticks

[Bergy_Berg]

29 minutes ago, Peypeypeypey said:

I haven't really commented on my opinion of the fight, but I also think Beyond should win. He's probably a little less fast and has slightly less experience, but he does have enough training and he's quick enough that she's not just going to be able to slice him up. His vast arsenal is also going to do wonders for him here. This electric attack is capable of chipping apart a robot said to be made of Promethium. He has a wide variety of sonic, electric, and gas-based weaponry that he can throw at her, and the environment means he would never really be in trouble. He can always just fly away and at his speeds there's no way in hell she'll ever catch him. As far as I can tell, she has no real recourse if he just stays out of range. Going by the logic of "Wolverine can lose via concussion, etc.," Beyond is definitely strong enough and has a wide enough arsenal to concuss her and get a win. If it were in close quarters I would agree that he's in trouble, but this setting makes it trivial for him to stay safe indefinitely and pelt her with weapons until something sticks

<3

[UMPIRE]

Match Final Results

Batman Beyond: 4
X-23: 12

[SSJRuss]

All of that for just 4 votes?

[Z451]

8 minutes ago, SSJRuss said:

All of that for just 4 votes?

Heh, hey Grom lost with only 4 votes too.