The Pro Wrestling thread

[Helen C]

You seriously think anyone would look at the Brock Lesnar match and think he was a loser. Lesner killed him, Cena had to use underhanded tactics to win. Cena, the babyface, had to use underhanded tactics to beat Lesnar, the heel, who'd been dominating him the entire match. Lesnar came out of the match looking better than Cena. The booking was perfect. Remember the Stone Cold/Bret Hart match at Mania? What do people remember about it? That Hart won, or that Austin refused to give up? It's a similar thing here. People will remember the beat down.

 

And a good match isn't about the number of moves(!) you do. For one thing, every wrestler has the infamous 5 moves of doom. It's called a move set, and a good wrestler get's their shit in every match that isn't a squash. For another, it's about connecting to an audience and getting people emotionally invested. Give me Ryback squashing jobbers over a ridiculously long ROH match in which everyone no sells everything any day. Cena does that. Watch the Lesnar match. He got a hostile Chicago crowd cheering for him with well timed hope spots and brilliant selling. The character had gotten stale, yes, but the matches have been great and recently his character and mike work have been improving also.

 

They replaced them? They couldn't replace Hogan until Austin came around - Hart and Michaels, much as I love both of them, never had the same star power. They didn't replace the Rock and Austin until Wrestlemania 21, with Batista and Cena. Cena has an aura and you can't say the only reason for that has been the WWE's promotion. Cena's rapper gimmick, that origionally got him over, was all down to him. Look at how hard they tried with Mr Kennedy - that went nowhere because he's just not that good and can't seem to wrestle any match without picking up an injury. Cena's awesome whenever he has a hostile crowd, because he doesn't let them put him off and plays to them. Look at the One Night Stand match against RVD, he's brilliant. Also this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvKRYFXuiNI

 

I'm not a massive Cena fan, he's far from my favourite and given the choice I'd rather watch Lesnar. But damn, he's good.

 

 

 

Anyway, to make a new point: Y'all need to watch more classic Ric Flair.

[Guest bigballerju]

John Cena use to be fun and entertaining. Watch him back in 2004 to 2007 which were his best years. John Cena was hated and still is because his gimmeck has grown stale. We are in 2012 the Hulk Hogan lite gimmeck is not good for this era and thats why before Brock Lesner came he had started going down a bad path which is why WWE had to do something quick.

 

Brock Lesner in a way saved Cena because Brock is so damn great as a heel he turned Cena completely face again. Cena needed someone like Brock to turn him face again. John Cena needed to be completely destroyed in the match but barely get a win to win over the crowd. It was perfect actually. Brock looked extremely good as a monster heel and Cena is a face people love again because they want to see him win this war against Brock.

 

By the way Daniel Bryan vs CM Punk at this upcoming PPV for the title is going to be a awesome match and feud.

[comic_book_fan]

i am more of cm punk and HHH fan than lesnar or cena.

i thought anderson was good yeah he got hurt alot but so did orton and they didn't fire him.

i mostly watch tna waiting for sting to come back but it's great rvd is there while sting is gone.

i hope rock vs brock 2 happens so rock can get some redemption for loseing to brock.

[Guest Square Pickle]

John Cena use to be fun and entertaining. Watch him back in 2004 to 2007 which were his best years. John Cena was hated and still is because his gimmeck has grown stale. We are in 2012 the Hulk Hogan lite gimmeck is not good for this era and thats why before Brock Lesner came he had started going down a bad path which is why WWE had to do something quick. Brock Lesner in a way saved Cena because Brock is so damn great as a heel he turned Cena completely face again. Cena needed someone like Brock to turn him face again. John Cena needed to be completely destroyed in the match but barely get a win to win over the crowd. It was perfect actually. Brock looked extremely good as a monster heel and Cena is a face people love again because they want to see him win this war against Brock. By the way Daniel Bryan vs CM Punk at this upcoming PPV for the title is going to be a awesome match and feud.

Agreed on the Punk/Danielson match. Theyre two of the best in the business today for sure... I agree with the "Hulk Hogan Lite" comment, in fact thats why I hate modern Cena. Dont get me wrong, I dont hate John Cena as a person, but the Super Cena gimmick got old in lat 2005. I will admit that I was once part of the "ChainGang". Ive seen Cena since his first match against Angle in '02, and I way always a big fan of the Doctor of Thuganomics, but after WrestleMania 21 when he was drafted to RAW he almost instantly tried to be the "new" Hulk Hogan. I hated that as a Hogan fan, because in this day and age, that gimmick is stupid. Why is it different when Hogan did it? Because he invented the Super Wrestler gimmick, and he had the look, the size, and the attitude. The only credit Cena can really take for charisma is what the writers tell him to say. As 2003 Cena, it showed true guts and talent for him to remember his rap lines on the way to the ring. All he's really said for the past 7 years is, "Never give up!" and "Never back down!". It doesnt take a wrestling historian to see that his catch phraises are the modern day "Train, take your vitamins, and say your prayers". Hogan has my respect for revolutionizing the wrestling industry. I hate John Cena's guts (kayfabe), because he isnt doing anything new. He's trying to be Hulk Hogan. His rapper gimmick was funner, more innovative, and more controversial. Modern day Cena... has been saying the same crap for 7 years. We get it John. You never give up. Im not saying he's hopeless. Im just saying he's been a broken record for the last 7 years, and his gimmick is complete crap.

 

Also...

 

Cena's move list: Shoulder block (x3), Spin-out powerbomb, 5 Knuckle Shuffle, AA, STF. If its a $60 PPV, he may even throw in a 6th move... yay.

[Helen C]

That's not his move set, that's his set comeback. Shawn Michaels has one. Triple H has one. The Rock has one. Hulk Hogan had one. The way matches are usually structured, a babyface usually will use less moves in a match than the heel.

 

Yes, Cena had gotten stale (in spite of his matches continuing to be awesome). Until he met the Rock. Cena more than held his own in those promos, and his delivery was excellent. Delivery is more important than what the writers wrote for him, and his delivery has always been good. With the Rock, he showed real emotion and talent.

 

It's cool to not like Cena. It's all opinion on that front. It's not cool to say he's untalented, or any less talented than other guys on the roster.

[Guest bigballerju]

Thats the thing that makes everyone even more angry at Cena. We know Cena can wrestle good (His hour long match with Shawn Michaels on that Raw was excellent) and cut great promos. However until Rock or even that match with CM Punk last year Cena was obviously phoning it in.

 

I'm glad Cena losing in this storyline and is being broken down. Its gone help his character and give him a sort of reboot to start over new in a way as a Face.

[Guest tomisntblue]

I believe there is a CBUBer who still does.

Yes, there is.

 

Anyway, to contribute more to the topic than just bragging about winning my first championship:

 

On the topic of Brock and Cena. In the ring, I no doubt like Brock Lesnar better. He's crap on the mic, but he has talent in the ring. As far as I'm concerned with Cena, he's a really good wrestler (go back and watch his matches before he had his brake out match against JBL) he's just too set in his routine and WWE wants to play it safe and doesn't want him going too far out of his 5 moves of doom for... whatever reason. Anyway, Cena's mic skills are also pretty good, but again I don't think he really gets enough time to shine because he has to be the golden boy. Behind the scenes it's obvious who cares more. Cena's one of the most dedicated workers WWE has right now and from that perspective he has earned his spot as the face of WWE. Lesnar, is in it for a pay check and to feed his ego.

 

As for the match itself, I'm happy it went how it went. Brock got to shine as the power house that he is and dominated the match. But if he had won, it would have been a HUGE let down from a story perspective. The fact is, a good match tells a good story. This one basically said that, John Cena, Wrestling's Superman, met a force he just could not stop (AKA: wrestling's Doomsday) and had to play a little dirty to win.

 

To answer the question of favorites:

 

My favorite wrestler of all time is Chris Benoit. I don't want to get into personal feelings about him as a person or what happened. Without bringing that into the conversation, and focusing solely on his work in the ring, he was, without a doubt one of the best performers of all time.

 

My favorite current wrestler is CM Punk. Two notable runners up are, Chris Jericho and Bryan Daniels (AKA Daniel Bryan). I'm stopping there, because there's plenty of other wrestlers who I could call "favorites".

 

As far as favorite matches, I have to say Chris Benoit vs Shawn Micheals vs HHH at Wrestlemania (some number that I can't exactly remember). And again, I don't want to spend forever going over ever match that I'd call a favorite. But I will mention that Shames and John Morrison put on one hell of a ladder match last year that took my respect for both men to a whole new level.

 

That's all I'll say for now, I'll be back with plenty more to say when it's not 3:30 in the morning.

[Helen C]

Lost 7 pounds of fat over the last week, and have been working on building muscle too.

 

Why?

 

I miss wrestling damn it. I plan to get back to training on Saturday and hopefully re-learn the craft and re-earn my spot on the roster. Got some bloody stiff competition these days though, the roster currently has some of the best in the country and has started bringing in American Ring of Honour stars.

 

[Helen C]

And I got back into training today. (Huzzah!)

 

Let's see how long it takes before I work my way back onto the roster.

[Guest tomisntblue]

And I got back into training today. (Huzzah!)

 

Let's see how long it takes before I work my way back onto the roster.

 

Best of luck to you. Can't wait to hear how it goes.

[Helen C]

Thanks!

 

In other news, watched Slammiversary last night. When did TNA stop being shit and become awesome again?

[Helen C]

Right, off to bed before I spend the next week being battered by former Ring of Honour champion Davey Richards. Wish me luck in a training course that will inevitably feature a lot of pain and more squats than should be legally allowed.

[Helen C]

That was a brilliant if painful week. Davey Richards is the best technical wrestler in the world and my own technical knowledge has expanded ten fold. I learned so much, and my cardio and workout regime has become a hell of a lot better. *vulgarity*ing brilliant week.

 

 

Painful as *vulgarity* though. Walking after training was hard. First thing we did on Monday was 500 squats and shit just got harder from there.

[comic_book_fan]

anybody here about king.

[Helen C]

Here about King? Why would we be here about King? But yeah, horrible what happened. It may be the end of his in ring career. He's very lucky this happened at a WWE show with paramedics backstage, and not one of the indy bookings he takes in Memphis throughout the week.

[comic_book_fan]

Here about King? Why would we be here about King? But yeah, horrible what happened. It may be the end of his in ring career. He's very lucky this happened at a WWE show with paramedics backstage, and not one of the indy bookings he takes in Memphis throughout the week.

oops lol .

[Helen C]

...I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

 

Also, brilliant week was brilliant.

 

[The Blue Flame]

Right here is a great match

 

Part one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghnzYCitomk

 

Part two

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5FNuvtQkQs

[Guest Austo191]

Saw this thread had to post. The Shield's freakin' awesome! (Mostly just Dean Ambrose). Brad Maddox looks to be a future star. Big E. ....? Eh. Lots of debuts happening. Can't wait for Chris Hero (Kassius Ohno) to finally debut.

 

Also, does anyone here have an account on CAW.ws? It's basically a Pro Wrestling forum. Just wondering.

[comic_book_fan]

i am now.

[Helen C]

Between the Shield and Ryback, WWE have done well with introducing new characters recently. Ryback's popularity has exploded, he's a future star for sure, and the Shield are all very talented and have a bright future. The wonderful TLC match from Sunday proves it for all four men.

[Guest Austo191]

Out of the Shield, I only see Ambrose and Rollins going anywhere. Roman maybe even though he isn't very great in the ring (from what I've heard).

 

To me Ryback is still a bit green. Sometimes it shows. But I won't deny how popular he is.

 

And to comic book fan, what's your username on CAWS then?

[Helen C]

Roman's got the look and tonnes of character ("Get up fools, this is my table now!"), which is what actually matters. Ambrose has the best character. I'd say Rollins was the least equipped, he's mainly a risk taker, which doesn't make a career by itself - no doubt he has talent, but I'd say the others were better equipped.

 

Ryback's a big babyface monster, the best in that roll in years. He's got all the tools and is clearly dedicated. He doesn't need to be technically great, he needs to be good at throwing people about and looking like a scary bastard. And he's great at that.

[Guest Austo191]

I see your point with Ryback. Hogan, Austin, and Cena aren't really ring technicians either.

 

And what you were saying about Rollins? Look how Jeff Hardy turned. He was the #2 guy behind Cena for a while. I think Rollins will be a huge star one day.

[Guest tomisntblue]

I'm loving a lot of what WWE's doing as of late, especially concerning. The Shield is full of talent. Ryback is doing great work, though his main event push has come too soon. I think there hands were tied with that when Cena got injured, so I understand it, but Vince does tend to push new big guys too fast. I'm just hoping Ryback continues to improve and entertain and earn true main event status. Claudio's (Antonio Cesaro) US Title run is being handled well and I'm glad they're starting to let him use his own style more as his career progresses. And, without a doubt, my favorite character in WWE right now is Daimien Sandow. Only time will tell if Big E Langston will branch out and have a decent run on his own, but teaming him with Dolph Ziggler and AJ for the time being shows that they have high hopes for him. I'm glad WWE's realizing how important it is to build younger talent again, instead of relying on the same main eventers and the same matches.

 

Edit: Forgot to mention Brad Maddox. I like the story line he's in, it's an interesting way to bring him in. My only complaint was that I wish had longer matches with Ryback and Orton. Sure, Ryback's the monster face and Orton's the resident ass kicker, but they could have let him extend the matches a few minutes by using some more heel tactics, which would in turn make him getting beat down have a bigger pay off and let him build more heel heat.