Mythbusters: CBUB

[Guest bigballerju]

MYTH: Goku is not at FTL levels

 

If someone gives reason why he isnt Ill try to counter. Anytime Goku is against someone like Supes or on his level, most people say Goku loses cuz of the speed difference, but never really says why he isnt.

 

Goku and other DBZ fighters can fight at light speed.

 

However for some reason they can't fly or run at light speed.

 

Its stupid I know but thats the way I have seen it in DBZ and thats the way it

always was.

[Guest Redemption X]

I have a question for you: Would you be by any chance... Jamie Reyes/Blue Beetle/Agustinaldo?

 

Who?

[Hugo Fowl]

Who?

 

Don't worry about it. He was just some idiot with his head up his ass. Lazy as hell and a lousy writer at that. Some of his works are actually "Hall of Shame" famed now for what not to do. Its a sad story, but hey! Some people just have no brains. The guys are all just annoyed because a pathetic habit of his was him trying to come back under different names. Ah well.

 

That said, welcome to EF.

 

PM me if you wanna know more about him. Because some of his stuff he did was just way to hilarious to not share.

[Guest Omega11]

Not really. There is zero evidence that Obi-Wan new or even thought Anakin could be redeemed.

 

Regardless Obi-Wan serves the will of the Force, and the will of the Force was that Anakin be redeemed therefore Obi-Wan was trying to get Anakin redeemed.

 

And his death really didn't help keep Luke from getting shot down. If anything having a live, lightsaber weilding Jedi Master by your side would have been far more effective.

 

By his side, yes. But Obi-Wan wasn't by Luke's side, he was fighting Vader. And if the fight were prolonged more and more stormtroopers would have flooded the hanger making it more and more unlikely that any of them would escape alive.

[Guest LegendX]

Regardless Obi-Wan serves the will of the Force, and the will of the Force was that Anakin be redeemed therefore Obi-Wan was trying to get Anakin redeemed.

 

 

 

By his side, yes. But Obi-Wan wasn't by Luke's side, he was fighting Vader. And if the fight were prolonged more and more stormtroopers would have flooded the hanger making it more and more unlikely that any of them would escape alive.

1. No. Just because it was the will of the Force the Anakin be redeemed doesn't mean Obi knew that. If fact everthing Obi said about Vader indicates that he didn't. So, saying he was "trying" to redeem Ani is a stretch.

 

2. Fine, sure. I guess. Still doesn't mean Obi could have beaten Vader. I still say he couldn't and you probably aren't going to convince me otherwise, so we should probably drop this here.

[Guest Omega11]

1. No. Just because it was the will of the Force the Anakin be redeemed doesn't mean Obi knew that. If fact everthing Obi said about Vader indicates that he didn't. So, saying he was "trying" to redeem Ani is a stretch.

 

You're right, "trying" isn't the right word.

 

What I mean is that whether he knew it or not, Obi-Wan's actions were leading to Anakin's return to the light.

 

He wanted to obey the Force, and the Force wanted Anakin to turn good again, so if Obi-Wan hadn't obeyed the Force, Anakin might not have turned good again.

[Guest LegendX]

You're right, "trying" isn't the right word.

 

What I mean is that whether he knew it or not, Obi-Wan's actions were leading to Anakin's return to the light.

 

He wanted to obey the Force, and the Force wanted Anakin to turn good again, so if Obi-Wan hadn't obeyed the Force, Anakin might not have turned good again.

Agree, we do, on this point.

[Guest bigballerju]

I don't think Obi Wan thought Anakin could be redeemed.

 

In Episode 4 as well as 5 when he told Luke about his father he spoke and even said his father was

lost to the dark side of the force. Obi Wan kept telling that to Luke as if he thought his father was forever lost to the dark side.

 

Thats the reason Obi Wan told Yoda Luke was their only chance of destroying the dark side.

[Guest Hayesmeister5651]

MYTH: Goku is not at FTL levels

 

If someone gives reason why he isnt Ill try to counter. Anytime Goku is against someone like Supes or on his level, most people say Goku loses cuz of the speed difference, but never really says why he isnt.

Well the case Ill make that DBZ characters are capable of combat at light speed. Goku with a PL of 300 was able to doooooooodge (10 points for who knows what I am referring to) lightning. Lightning travels at 224,00 MPH light speed moves at 671 million mph. 671 mill divided by 224,000 equals 3,000 (rounded up). In other words speed of light is 3,000 times faster then lightning. Goku in Frieza saga (Ill use Frieza saga cause that is when they were offical) had a PL of 13.5 million. So 13.5 million divided by 300 is 45,000. So Goku was 45,000 times stronger then he was in Dragonball. In DBZ when they get stronger everything is amplified, speed, reflexes, strength etc. So 45,000 is 15 times that of 3,000. So I believe that anyone that is a Super Saiyan or higher is capable of light speed combat. My logic could be wrong, but hey it was a hunch, and I figured Mythbusters would be the place to test it.

 

I also think he has light speed reactions, due to what I said above, and the fact that he can sense ki. So if Superman was to get behind him to attack, he would sense his ki and react to it. That simple.

 

Again if someone could prove me wrong go for it, I like to learn but dont say they "cant be light speed, just cause" give some reasoning as to why.

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

Well the case Ill make that DBZ characters are capable of combat at light speed. Goku with a PL of 300 was able to doooooooodge (10 points for who knows what I am referring to) lightning. Lightning travels at 224,00 MPH light speed moves at 671 million mph. 671 mill divided by 224,000 equals 3,000 (rounded up). In other words speed of light is 3,000 times faster then lightning. Goku in Frieza saga (Ill use Frieza saga cause that is when they were offical) had a PL of 13.5 million. So 13.5 million divided by 300 is 45,000. So Goku was 45,000 times stronger then he was in Dragonball. In DBZ when they get stronger everything is amplified, speed, reflexes, strength etc. So 45,000 is 15 times that of 3,000. So I believe that anyone that is a Super Saiyan or higher is capable of light speed combat. My logic could be wrong, but hey it was a hunch, and I figured Mythbusters would be the place to test it.

 

I also think he has light speed reactions, due to what I said above, and the fact that he can sense ki. So if Superman was to get behind him to attack, he would sense his ki and react to it. That simple.

 

Again if someone could prove me wrong go for it, I like to learn but dont say they "cant be light speed, just cause" give some reasoning as to why.

I personally believe they are there's the lightning feat obviously but there are a few other things. For one Goku has moved fast enough for Kami and Kaio to lose sight of them beings who can see the smallest thing in entire planets or as kaio goes whole galaxies. Also Vegeta before super saiyajin could vanish in and out of sight in 300X gravity so he is 300X faster in earths gravity than in that and he was still vanishing. Now i would like to point to Goku vs Cell

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v34/c002/12.html

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v34/c002/13.html

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v34/c003/

 

They were moving to fast for the camera to pick up on there movements now they have been doing that for awhile but in this fight Cell isn't using all his power. And with the way DBZ speed works more energy=more speed since Gohan explain that they move fast/fly by pushing there energy outwards to propel themselves in a direction now when they fly they only use enough energy so that there making some at the same rate but they have enough energy to destroy the planet 100's of times over more than enough energy to move a human sized object at light speed. Also there are times even when there sensing there opponents energy that they lose there opponent this means they are moving faster than the light there energy is emitting

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v27/c009/5.html

If you look Freeza's energy is still in front of Goku while Freeza is above him his energy hadn't caught up with him.

Also Goku managed to out run a explosion.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v26/c010/9.html

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v26/c010/10.html

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v26/c010/11.html

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v26/c010/12.html

This was with a power level of 3,000,000 as a super saiyajin he had a power level of 150,000,000 thats 50X faster than that and like Vegeta he could vanish in 100X gravity without the Kaioken and a PL of 90,000.

[Guest bigballerju]

Goku definitely has super speed but he just can't fly or run ftl.

 

Goku when he was young in Dragonball used super-speed and super-strength alot.

 

When he was young he was extremely fast and since then he only got faster.

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

Goku definitely has super speed but he just can't fly or run ftl.

 

Goku when he was young in Dragonball used super-speed and super-strength alot.

 

When he was young he was extremely fast and since then he only got faster.

If Goku poured enough energy into flying/running he could probably go FTL Gotenks went near FTL while flying without ssj3 and without using all his energy.

[Indolent]

Uh, since when did Gotenks go "Near FTL"?

[AVP vs The Terminator]

No canon DBZ character has achieved FTL speeds, barring Vegito.

They can definetely move far faster than the human eye can follow, but they're nowhere near FTL. Maybe if an SSJ3 went through a few hundred Zenkais it could achieve FTL.

Until then, no.

[Guest Hayesmeister5651]

So are my numbers right? Do they make sense, cuz if so they can be FTL.

[Guest bigballerju]

No character in DBZ has been FTL period.

 

Thats why when they fly it takes them time to get to where they are going.

 

Hell when they run at super speed there still nowhere close.

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

Uh, since when did Gotenks go "Near FTL"?

When he flew around the world 5 times in less then a second.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v40/c010/8.html

The point is they use more energy when there fighting to move then when they fly from point A to point B and acheive the vanishing speeds even in 400X gravity and up.

[Indolent]

When he flew around the world 5 times in less then a second.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v40/c010/8.html

The point is they use more energy when there fighting to move then when they fly from point A to point B and acheive the vanishing speeds even in 400X gravity and up.

Hrm, I went through this with another member on EF, I believe it was Hayes. We did some number crunching: It isn't anywhere close to FTL, not at all. It was in the range of from .1% to .10% of lightspeed, as I cannot remember the exact figure that was determined.

 

Might've been higher... but still no where close.

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

Hrm, I went through this with another member on EF, I believe it was Hayes. We did some number crunching: It isn't anywhere close to FTL, not at all. It was in the range of from .1% to .10% of lightspeed, as I cannot remember the exact figure that was determined.

 

Might've been higher... but still no where close.

umm you can go around the earth 7.8 times in a second at light speed he went 5 in less than a second A LOT closer to light speed than .1-.10%

[Guest tomisntblue]

Umm, this might be ignorance or nit-picking or whatever but is "close to FTL" really an accurate term? I mean FTL means "faster than Light" so wouldn't close to that be moving at light speed?

[Guest Ruinus]

When he flew around the world 5 times in less then a second.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/dragon_ball/v40/c010/8.html

The point is they use more energy when there fighting to move then when they fly from point A to point B and acheive the vanishing speeds even in 400X gravity and up.

 

Where does it show or say he did that in less than a second?

[Indolent]

Ah, give me a few days, I'll try to find the thread then...

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

Where does it show or say he did that in less than a second?

The fact that the aura overlaps means it was at least a second.

Light

Speed of light = 186,282.4 miles/second. Earth's circumference at equator = 24,901.55 miles

Revolutions = speed / circumference

Revolutions = (186,282.4 miles/second) / (24,901.55 miles)

Revolutions = 7.48 times

 

Gotenks circled 5 times in a second so

24,901 miles X 5= 124,505 miles

Speed= Distance/Time and 124,505/1=124,505 miles/second

Edit:66.83% of light speed

[Guest Ruinus]

The fact that the aura overlaps means it was at least a second.

Light

Speed of light = 186,282.4 miles/second. Earth's circumference at equator = 24,901.55 miles

Revolutions = speed / circumference

Revolutions = (186,282.4 miles/second) / (24,901.55 miles)

Revolutions = 7.48 times

 

Gotenks circled 5 times in a second so

24,901 miles X 5= 124,505 miles

Speed= Distance/Time and 124,505/1=124,505 miles/second

 

I didn't know a single panel means it's one second.

 

And I guess this entire conversationthis took 7 seconds?

 

I mean shit, it isn't just artistic license tracing out his path because why? Doesn't really matter though, because apperantly his transformation has a duration of 30 minutes. Here Piccolo says that he only has a minute of transformation left (after Gotenks flew around the Earth and took a nap). So from here on we know that the time left is 60 seconds.

 

The very next page has him flying towards boo.

 

The page after that has him immediately unfuse, meaning that his time was up. That means it took him at max 60 seconds to get from Piccolo's position to Buu's. Yet, if we were to believe this ridiculous light speed nonsense, Gotenks should have taken no time at all to arrive at the supposed fight. What, he can fly around the Earth 5 times in a second, yet he can't reach Buu in under a minute?

 

It'd be much easier for you to get the cartoon version of this, the one that actually shows him moving around the Earth, count the number of times he circles the Earth and the time required. Not rely on a single still image.

[Guest Darksaiyajin345]

I didn't know a single panel means it's one second.

 

And I guess this entire conversationthis took 7 seconds?

 

I mean shit, it isn't just artistic license tracing out his path because why? Doesn't really matter though, because apperantly his transformation has a duration of 30 minutes. Here Piccolo says that he only has a minute of transformation left (after Gotenks flew around the Earth and took a nap). So from here on we know that the time left is 60 seconds.

 

The very next page has him flying towards boo.

 

The page after that has him immediately unfuse, meaning that his time was up. That means it took him at max 60 seconds to get from Piccolo's position to Buu's. Yet, if we were to believe this ridiculous light speed nonsense, Gotenks should have taken no time at all to arrive at the supposed fight. What, he can fly around the Earth 5 times in a second, yet he can't reach Buu in under a minute?

 

It'd be much easier for you to get the cartoon version of this, the one that actually shows him moving around the Earth, count the number of times he circles the Earth and the time required. Not rely on a single still image.

I don't see how it couldn't be 1 second considering 10 seconds =14 pages and we all know how 5 minutes equals a few chapters and Goku had a conversation with everyone in the 10 seconds cell was going to explode in the next page he also mentions he took a nap and while yes it should only take him X amount of time to get to buu iit took Goku the 3 hours to cross snake way (600,000+miles) he should have been able to get to every one that Nappa was killing (even if on the other side of the world maybe 6,000+ miles from Kami's palace ) It should have taken him no time yet he flies Kinto'un instead and takes the extra time. Also he gets to Freeza in a fraction of a second which means if Gotenks wanted to yes he could get to Buu's in a fraction of a second. Gotenks flying around the earth was meant to show just how powerful he was since he didn't even try.

So yes that conversation you showed could have taken 7 seconds considering how long it took for Goku to say goodbye to everyone teleport Cell to Kaio-sama apologize and then explode.