Match 11548 Darkseid and Thanos vs. The Silver Surfer and Doctor Manhattan

[Guest .Big Game James.]

Darkseid and Thanos have once again decided to work as a team and attempt to take over Earth and it's heroes. They want to wipe Earth of it resources and possibly even recruit villains to fight by their sides. Their past attempts by themselves have seemed to fail miserably. This time they believe their master plan could not only take over Earth but more than likely take over the entire multiverse. However, the two faces of evil may not get away with their plan so easily. Two of Earth's most powerful heroes have heard about the evil doings of Darkseid and Thanos. Silver Surfer and Dr. Manhattan have taken matters into their own hands to save Earth and return it back to it's normal state. Can the two heroes get the job done or will Earth crumble under Darkseid and Thanos' evil plan?

 

 

damn shoulda used monarch captain atom instead of manhattan.

[Callisto]

Learn More About

Thanos

Read more about Thanos at Wikipedia

Official Site: Marvel Comics Links: Thanos' Wiki Profile The Marvel Directory: Thanos Marvel's Official Page on Thanos

 

Darkseid

Read more about Darkseid at Wikipedia

Official Site: DC Comics Links: Wikipedia: Darkseid DC Database: Darkseid JLA Watchtower: Darkseid

 

Doctor Manhattan

Read more about Doctor Manhattan at Wikipedia

Official Site: DC Comics Links: Doctor Manhattan on Wikipedia Dr. Manhattan fansite (archive.org) The Annotated Watchmen

 

The Silver Surfer

Read more about The Silver Surfer at Wikipedia

Official Site: Marvel Links: Wikipedia: The Silver Surfer The Marvel Database Project: The Silver Marvel.com: The Silver Surfer

 

 

[Guest Shoggoth breeder]

So Darkseid has the Anti-life Equation and Thanos has the Infinity Gauntlet?

Definitely voting for team 1.

[Guest .Big Game James.]

So Darkseid has the Anti-life Equation and Thanos has the Infinity Gauntlet?

Definitely voting for team 1.

nah i changed it. i already figure most ppl will choose team 1 no matter what the case so it doesn't really matter. lol

[Guest Shoggoth breeder]

True

[Guest Redemption X]

damn shoulda used monarch captain atom instead of manhattan.

 

Doctor Manhattan is the Watchmen-verse version of Captain Atom, so it should make no difference

[Guest .Big Game James.]

Doctor Manhattan is the Watchmen-verse version of Captain Atom, so it should make no difference

yeah it does. it's kinda like the whole hulk loose cannon thing.

[Guest Redemption X]

yeah it does. it's kinda like the whole hulk loose cannon thing.

 

Loose Cannon is an inferior copy of the Hulk. Doctor Manhattan is a copy of Captain Atom, but he's in no way inferior.

[DSkillz]

Eh, this is not too far from a rumble. I'll give it a "C", though, since there's at least a story.

 

And since you seem to making an arc with Darkseid and Thanos, BGJ, may I suggest stronger opponents? No one you've matched them up with so far stands anywhere near a chance against their combined might and smarts. You'd probably have to match them up against a virtually ominpotent enemy, but even then they may be able to strategize enough to make it interesting.

 

Or better yet, have Darkseid and Thanos fight opponents separately. You'd still have to find good matchups for them, though.

[Guest .Big Game James.]

a partially fed Big G and COIE Anti-Monitor v. Pre-Crisis DS and Thanos w/ The Infinity Gauntlet???

 

then you have DS and Thanos losing bigtime!

 

Cosmic Armor Supes and Rune King Thor vs. DS and Thanos?

 

That's not a bad one right?

[Guest Garland]

Silver Surfer is not powerful enough

 

Doctor Manhattan's another fish altogether. He is quite powerful, but not enough to make up the difference between himself and Surfer.

[Guest Redemption X]

Pre-Crisis Darkseid and Infinity Gauntlet Thanos VS Superboy Prime and Black Adam.

 

How about that?

[AVP vs The Terminator]

Pre-Crisis Darkseid and Infinity Gauntlet Thanos VS Superboy Prime and Black Adam.

 

How about that?

Noooo.

[Guest force_echo]

1: Redemption X is completely retarded.

 

2: It depends on Surfer. If Surfer is mad and is, mentally, at full fighting capacity- Surfer can take out Darkseid, Manhattan can at least keep Thanos busy, then Surfer returns to take out Thanos.

[Guest .Big Game James.]

Pre-Crisis Darkseid and Infinity Gauntlet Thanos VS Superboy Prime and Black Adam.

 

How about that?

i'm putting cosmic armor supes on a higher level than superboy prime.

[Guest .Big Game James.]

Noooo.

my orginal setup was ale seid and ig thanos v. surfer and manhattan. the first post was negative. sb-prime and adam won't cut it either. oops that was posed to be a reply to avp v terminators post. my bad

[xLEGACYx]

1: Redemption X is completely retarded.

 

2: It depends on Surfer. If Surfer is mad and is, mentally, at full fighting capacity- Surfer can take out Darkseid, Manhattan can at least keep Thanos busy, then Surfer returns to take out Thanos.

In no way does Surfer have the power to take out pre crisis darkseid. Darkseid is massively smarter and stronger in every way. His Omega beams alone would strip Surfer of his powers and leave him suffocating in space. Saying Silver Surfer can beat Darkseid is like saying Surfer can beat Galactus one on one. (While Darkseid is no as powerful as Galactus, the distance in power of Darkseid and Surfer is clearly large.) Darkseid has created his own beings like Strayne that have shown to be just as powerful as Surfer. So I ask how could Surfer overpower one of the strongest and most brillant minds in DC or Marvel?

[baneblade]

I had been observing this for a time, and saw that none of my fellow feretters touched on the possibilities accruing to Manhattan and team. While lesser in terms of power, lets not forget some things: Powers are only subject to situations in the comic verse, and perhaps even in real life.

 

That said, Seid and Thanos will 'probably' win. I say 'probably' because their existence, as has been debated before, and hinted indirectly in comic publications and various forums, is more of an anomaly, a random, yet necessary occurance that is warranated when a little 'shake-up' in the scales is required. In that regard, I would say that they would be in one way or another 'immune' to the most potent force in this battle: Manhattan's powers. Manhattan's singular power is so over the top, and so lethal, that even both Seid and Thanos, in a direct conflict will be at par with him, if not below. The shifting of probability, and reality, with a mere thought. Although it is only basic science at work, it works fast, really fast, and it works in synchronity with Manhattan's thought. Ex: He thinks thinks Seid's ship is re-arranged into a cube, it simply is. The dissipation, re-arrangement of molecules occur at such an astounding speed of thought, that it is intantaneous. No being is beyond that. However, since Manhattan is not 'God' (ala Alan Moore), he has 'limitations' confined strictly to not what he can or can't do, but simply in the ingrained conscious in him, that he has those limitations. That is why, he was awed by the definition of 'miracle' by the end of his one time tale.

 

I just wanted to put that into words, so that everyone realises Manhattan's power, and not just write him off.

 

That said, the only thing that works in favour of Seid and Thanos, with Manhattan as an opponent is the 'grander scheme', that would allow them to effect events around their opponents, and Manhattan, even though comprehending the situation or the immediate future, would either leave the landscape of battle, leaving Surfer to get yet embarrassed again, or just 'shield certain things, and then vanish. That is the most likely outcome, when I consider Manhattan's powers and history, (not to mention, perhaps most essentially, his 'ingrained' sensibilities).

 

In a capsule, if this was a 'computer-calculated' match, Manhattan would almost have a step ahead, even if he doesn't win a war, he would win battles here and there, to make it a draw. (That too, I put, with his psychological limitations intact). Based on a more realistic comparison however, Seid and Thanos will likely take it.

[Guest anu]

In no way does Surfer have the power to take out pre crisis darkseid. Darkseid is massively smarter and stronger in every way. His Omega beams alone would strip Surfer of his powers and leave him suffocating in space. Saying Silver Surfer can beat Darkseid is like saying Surfer can beat Galactus one on one. (While Darkseid is no as powerful as Galactus, the distance in power of Darkseid and Surfer is clearly large.) Darkseid has created his own beings like Strayne that have shown to be just as powerful as Surfer. So I ask how could Surfer overpower one of the strongest and most brillant minds in DC or Marvel?

 

In no way does Surfer have the power to take out pre crisis darkseid. Darkseid is massively smarter and stronger in every way.

 

Ok prove it and give an example of this. Then give an example of how you understand the power cosmic, obviously you don't because if you did you would see that the power cosmic matches up to everything Darkseid can do if not more on a grander scale. If you know anything about the surfer he can use the power cosmic to make himself stronger physically to where he could battle DS to a physical standstill if he wanted to.

 

Really you ask HOW the Surfer could when you obviously have not read the list of the powers for him. Once you do that then come back and say that. You guys are so DS crazy that you don't understand that just because a being is hardly ever defeated in his universe that he must be powerful across any universe he is a part of and that's not true.

 

Plus there is no true CREATIVITY in these battles. If its not a slug out or not a blast fest you guys seem to have a problem with being able to conceptualize how in the world some of these fights would go. Regardless of how 'smart' Darkseid is he doesn't show much more intelligence if he's outwitted by Batman in some of the simplest schemes. He's so smart right? Well if he was so smart then why hasn't he come up with a way to destroy Superman or why couldn't he 'devise' a way to handle Doomsday when Doomsday beat the crap out of him? I am sure such a "smart" being should have been able to come up with a plan or come up with something before he was put in a position where he was beaten nearly to death.

 

Dude, he may know things yet he doesn't show it in the comics to where he is 'supremely' intelligent.

 

 

So go back and read the Surfer's powers and read Darkseids powers and you will see a lot of similarities to where your point isn't correct.

[Guest force_echo]

Easy, use his cosmic awareness to see that 'Seid has a weakness to Radon, then just pelts him with the stuff. Usually, he wouldn't do this because his nature isn't to use lethal methods, but like I said, if he's serious he could.

[Guest Dr. Pymp(mex)]

Dr. Has the ability to see all possible futures (only for himself right?) so wouldn't he know how Darkseid and Thanos would win and avoid it? I mean he would know that DS has a beam that could kill him, watch and "see" what it does and then know what to do to avoid it or even cancel it

 

Mind you DS's beams aren't all powerful, and seeing how Dr is more DC than Marvel and how he is made to be "God" the OBeams might not work

 

Thanos rules everything with the IG regardless!

[Guest .Big Game James.]

this one goes down to omega effect vs. sub-atomic manipulation.

 

didn't batman dodge omega beams then proceed to shoot darkseid?

 

i hate going against seid and thanos, but manhattan and surfer take this one.

[xLEGACYx]

this one goes down to omega effect vs. sub-atomic manipulation.

 

didn't batman dodge omega beams then proceed to shoot darkseid?

 

i hate going against seid and thanos, but manhattan and surfer take this one.

No he didnt dodge them. Batman allowed just pulled off his shot and sacrificed himself to do so.

 

Also the Omega Beams can travel any direction, through any material, through any dimension, and any time. So they are all powerful except against kryptonians because of an unexplained reason.

[baneblade]

For the comments above from brothers Force and Anu.

 

1) Darkseid not beating Superman in a finality agenda has a two pronged background: First, the red line no villain can cross and which I am not even comprehending; Second, it is an on and off thing that if you have visited any sit downs with chief scribes who pen these stories, you will know that their 'reasons' are half and half. Half will be the convenienve and direction of the story and how it developed, and the other would be dark schemes of Seid who intentionally did not kill Superman as he saw in him a future unwitting pawn who would serve a higher purpose. Ex: In the Our World at War storyline, Darkseid had Superman trounced, and what followed next would just come naturally, what with an 'inert' Superman and fulyl powered Darkseid, but it didn't. When one of the questions was posed as to why not just finish him off? The answer was simple: Seid has a future plan for him, some kind of use.

 

2) Surfer simply skimming the 'impromptu catalog' of Seid'd weakness. Hmmmm. Logically, I would simply say that if it never worked elsewhere, or with a weaker or key opponent, then it definitely will not work with Seid. Folks have started to believe it as well I see the 'cracks' showing in that Surfer as nigh powerful argument. Guy's a pacifist. So, we have 2 routes there: Either we play dumb, and simply ignore the 'character' half, and just subtract the powers from the character. The other option is to play smart, and take his history, and tendencies, namely, his character in tow.

 

Now, about this thing about powers. See brothers, it works both ways. Sorry, but from team 2, I only gave the marginal advantage to Manhattan, purely if his powers worked on paper, not in reality or comic history terms. Surfer I do not. He is a non-factor here.

 

I don't even want to argue the point here. Thanos says: Oh, Seidie, don;t worry about this one. Him I have trounced multiple times. (Even if he did it once, it would count). Let me get rid of this one for us. I say it will happen. It has been established, Surfer just could not at his best, handle Thanos. What makes you think he will do it out of the blue right here? Logically, categorically, he will not beat Thanos.

 

Then, we have the question of power sets, as mentioned above. If Surfer has access to this power and that, do you think Seid will sit on his rocky behind and let him use it? If you speak purely on paper, then sure, here goes: Seid's one power is as originally stated in power stats by DC, able to trump all power sets here. His Omega beams are 'unavoidable'. (On paper now). Unavoidable, will always follow, tag or hit the 'intended' target. What they do is a variety of cool stuff. I choose the one with the singular outing in comic history, but it is there: Omega Sanction. Lets say Surfer fires his salvo and what not. Seid will power his. When he does, Surfer can't hide, can't avert. It follows, and hits, that is the stated power set. No ifs and buts about it. When it hits, Surfer will land his shiny behind in split relaities, 'one designated to be worse than the other'. In this, Johns put it more elaborately: If Seid wishes the traget dead: he will perish in those realities as he will be subject to all sequences designed to kill him. If Sied wants the target to merely suffer, but make it out (eventually) depending on their strong will, then be it so. It is upto Seid. This is his singular power that can take care of even multiple opponent. He has only used it once, and DC intended it that way, as they would run out of serious excuses of how folks would counter than one power.

 

So, kindly brothers, pay a little heed to history. History says, that naturally, Seid will want to keep Surfer around as his 'herald'. or Thanos will, and Manhattan will scamper for the high ground, not because he doesn't have that singular power to change probability, but only because his ingrained 'make of the Superior' can't be overhsadowed by him. He is effective, but part maker, and part spectator, in the Grand Make.

 

Thanos and Seid still win.

[Guest anu]

Ok that was a lot of running around the mount simply to say that you still don't want to give the power cosmic any credit. Since you would never see my point believe as you will. Yet guys are giving DS and Thanos way too much here. There are several things that Thanos can't do that Surfer can and on a grander scale yet again it's only going to go back and forth and back and forth and off such a crappy setup it's not really worth the energy to debate with you, so agree to disgaree and move on. I just think that DS and Thanos are overused in battles on this forum and really hyped as being way stronger than they actually are.