Deadliest Warriors:Predators(Yautja) vs Elites(Sangheili)

[Guest ricrery]

1) Yes, it's called Motion Radar and Enhanced Vision.

 

2) IDK you tell me. The Fact remains that an Elite could dodge it, and seek cover for it's shields to recharge.

 

3) IDK the Composition, but based on similar practices, the Radioactive round couldn't really have a density less than 15 g/cm³, and Since we use DU the SAME WAY that they use the round of this gun, it makes sense that they would opt for a Higher Density Material... Similar High density radioactive materials tend to be Pyrophoric too.

 

1 ) Elites have motion radar?

 

2 ) But if the shields fail, the Predator could real close and maybe use his net.

 

3 ) Well, Covenant weapons are exotic to say the least.

 

No, it defiantly would be, especially to unshielded targets. Face it, the rounds home in on targets, the round cut through armour like butter, the rounds then explode inside their target throwing microsharpnel into the wound. If they're wounded by a Needler then the wound would continue to get worse as the microsharpnel continues to cut through muscel and tendon.

 

Besides, they work against Spartans apparently, so they're not that bad a weapon.

 

This is going from the EU version. As stated before, Halo Wars is the least consistent Halo game, but it's still basically G Canon. I think that the only time they become the torso gutting weapons they are is when they hit something in a large mass.

 

Hmm, seeing as how it violates even the Games version of what would happen, as well as ALL OTHER SHOWINGS, then I believe that the Rule of Cool and Fred being Ultra Badass came into play and allowed him to live rather than be vaporized by the direct hit.

 

Which do you speak of (besides FS)?

[Guest force_echo]

Like I said before, the Elites win.

 

They are as strong as a freaking Spartan, what makes people think that the elite, at close quarters, wouldn't rip off the Pred's armor and beat the sh*t out of him? Every single weapon they have is like a plasma caster, because they have plasma weapons. A full kit from a plasma pistol can drain the energy sheilds of A Spartan's Mjolnir armor, no matter which version, and I think Skirmisher said something about it melting someone's head off. Plus the'r carbine and feul rod guns and stuff have a higher rate of fire. Add onto that that the Predators are hunters, while the Elites are soldiers. The elites are not prey lower in tech, skill, or physical prowress, they will destroy the Yajuta.

[Guest The JOKER!]

Predators take this after a long tough fight.

[Guest ricrery]

what makes people think that the elite, at close quarters, wouldn't rip off the Pred's armor and beat the sh*t out of him?

 

Because the Predator has shown superior durability and sometimes even strength. In close quarters combat, it's actually the Predator whooping the Elite.

[Skirmisher]

In Predator south china sea a single blast from a plasma caster destroyed a sniper tower in the Thai army fortress. This was also done to 4 other towers as well. This single predator that had only been on a few real hunts took out 150 thai soldiers using mortars, AA guns, M60's, AK-47s, AK-74s, grenades, and sniper rifles. He beat them and killed every one of them in one night.

 

Strategically he took out the towers first firing from different positions. Then he cut the power to the lights. Then he let the fear set in. Later he sent a ground glider full of explosives to blow a hole in one side of the fortress while he attacked the other side. He split the forces in half forcing them to come into confined spaces to find him. He cut them down methodically. The soldiers were ordered to retreat behind the inner wall for the time being. Then the pred gathered the heads of the dead and began throwing them over the wall and creating paranoia among the soldiers. Then just before dawn he came over the wall and destroyed the rest.

 

At the end of the night the pred has some cuts and just dents in his armor.

 

With this being a 9 on 9 fight the preds WILL WIN.

 

If this was an all out interstellar war than I would give it to the Elites but fighting in the jungle in a place where preds are used to fighting gives them the edge. Most Elites are war style fighters and not as comfotable at fighting in 1 on 1 style battles with foes who are equal in all ways but have more experience in this style fighting.

The thing is, how does any of that Relate to Sangheili?

 

They have better Equipment than the Thai Army... Hell, I bet half the world has better equipment than the Thai Army.

 

They have better Discipline than the Thai Army... Hell, I bet half the world has better equipment than the Thai Army.

 

Biologically they are more Fit than the Thai Army... Hell, I bet... oh, can't do that here.

 

 

Replay the same scenario with Elites instead of Thai Soldiers and you have a Drastically Different Scenario where the Predator might have to Fight to blow up a tower because they've spotted him coming from 125m away on the bases Motion Radar.

 

After that even if the pred somehow manages to cut the power the Sangheili wouldn't be overcome with Fear, they'd organize against the threat and counter it... after all their motion radars in their HUDs only show on enemy moving around. They would easily think that it might be a Cloaked Sangheili and the capabilities between the two soldiers wouldn't be that different. They'd implement counter Cloak tactics and strategies to surround and flush out the Cloaked predator easily and gun him down effortlessly since the pred doesn't have shields.

 

I don't car how Heat Resistant they are, when a Weapon causes 4th degree burns from Glancing hits, it's going to do pretty much the same thing to a Pred.

 

Thanks for anwsering mu qustion Skirmisher.

No problem. Although this does create a slight predicament... In the movie we see that their IR vision (the False Coloured version in the Film) was shown to see almost, kinda to work in the Hot Humid jungle... which, like the Mud Trick contradicts Reality.

 

 

The thing is, we don't know the RPM of the pistol, while we do know the RPM of the rifle. The pistol could also have been charged up just a bit without the novel stating this. If they are just slower than the rifle, or the scene had a charged version, then there is no massive inconsistency here.

Well, we do kinda.

 

Most Semi-Auto's can fire at a similar rate to a Full auto if the Person firing it is Fast. The thing about that is that it's all based on the Mechanics of the weapon. The Plasma Rifle automatically fires at it's maximum rated ROF, while only a person with a quick trigger finger could match those speeds on a Semi. But Match them they could.

 

And if you see how fast anyone can fire the PP, match them they did.

 

 

Halo Wars may be the black sheep of the series, but it's still a high canon source, and their combat scenes with Covenant weapons fits well with Bungie's own numbers. I mean, they're fighting guys with 7.62mm NATO rounds at like 900 m/s, so either they are glass cannons who can't tank their own weapons, or they don't use weapons that much superior to the UNSC in the first place.

Actually the Arbiter took a whole belly full of 7.62 rounds + a full clip of SAPHE .50 before his shields dropped, then he was stabbed in the neck with a knife and gutted with a Plasma Sword...

 

The Other Elites though were Minors, not even eligible to carry a real weapon... they were probably recent drafts, or apprentices fresh from the academy learning under the Arbiter in the field.

 

heh, I bet only after they've killed X enemy would they get a Rifle.

 

 

1 ) Elites have motion radar?

 

2 ) But if the shields fail, the Predator could real close and maybe use his net.

 

3 ) Well, Covenant weapons are exotic to say the least.

1) Yes, all elites have a HUD, it's those special Contact Lenses they where, or even apart of their helmets.

 

2) And pretty much any weapon the Elites have on them can cut or burn through their metal mesh nets.

 

3) True... but it makes sense that the Rounds have a density of between 15 and 20 g/cm³, which would still generate a Ke of equal or better than a .50 BMG round seen in Heavy Machineguns that are usually mounted on Vehicles.

[Skirmisher]

This is going from the EU version. As stated before, Halo Wars is the least consistent Halo game, but it's still basically G Canon. I think that the only time they become the torso gutting weapons they are is when they hit something in a large mass.

Actually, if we were going by Star Wars Canon then it's C-Canon.

 

 

Which do you speak of (besides FS)?

Well, the showing from First Strike, it had the Same situation almost, except Kelly was Critically Injured from IIRC a Glance hit or Splash damage.

 

Then there's even the games where they are a one hit Kill weapon. I believe this is baked up in the Manuals too.

 

The only recorded Not Fatal Hit was Fred who should be Dead.

[Guest The JOKER!]

Because the Predator has shown superior durability and sometimes even strength. In close quarters combat, it's actually the Predator whooping the Elite.

Agreed!

Predators rule!

[RakaiThwei]

Don't look at me everyone, I'm staying out of this one...

 

-Rakai'Thwei

[Guest ricrery]

Actually the Arbiter took a whole belly full of 7.62 rounds + a full clip of SAPHE .50 before his shields dropped, then he was stabbed in the neck with a knife and gutted with a Plasma Sword...

 

Which still doesn't support 45 kilojoule single bolts.

 

The Other Elites though were Minors, not even eligible to carry a real weapon... they were probably recent drafts, or apprentices fresh from the academy learning under the Arbiter in the field.

 

Actually, in Reach, Noble 6 kills a shielded Ultra by firing a third of his MA5 at it.

[Guest ricrery]

Actually, if we were going by Star Wars Canon then it's C-Canon.

 

Untrue. Bungie's word is that games override the EU, and that newer games override older games.

 

Then there's even the games where they are a one hit Kill weapon. I believe this is baked up in the Manuals too.

 

Remember, game mechanics aren't canon (as you stated before).

[Skirmisher]

Which still doesn't support 45 kilojoule single bolts.

Actually it kinda does.

 

The amount of fire he put into the Arbiter would have easily tied a couple shots from a PR, and besides, that's it's maximum theoretical yield.

 

Bottom is still 20 KJ

 

 

Actually, in Reach, Noble 6 kills a shielded Ultra by firing a third of his MA5 at it.

We don't know any conditions set on them before attacking N6.

 

They were on a Battlefield, presumably the Elite could have had it's shields shorted out BEFORE attacking N6 somewhere else in some other battle. Same for pretty much all the others too.

 

They had after all just fought against the UNSC Reach Army, and a Good number of UNSC Marines. Complete with Vehicle and air support while it lasted.

[Guest ricrery]

Actually it kinda does.

 

The amount of fire he put into the Arbiter would have easily tied a couple shots from a PR, and besides, that's it's maximum theoretical yield.

 

Bottom is still 20 KJ

 

Actually, a single volley of 9 bolts would generate 270 kilojoules, or 66 MA5 7.62mm NATO rounds. He didn't fire nearly that much, and that's just one volley from the rifle.

 

We don't know any conditions set on them before attacking N6.

 

They were on a Battlefield, presumably the Elite could have had it's shields shorted out BEFORE attacking N6 somewhere else in some other battle. Same for pretty much all the others too.

 

They had after all just fought against the UNSC Reach Army, and a Good number of UNSC Marines. Complete with Vehicle and air support while it lasted.

 

[Skirmisher]

Actually, a single volley of 9 bolts would generate 270 kilojoules, or 66 MA5 7.62mm NATO rounds. He didn't fire nearly that much, and that's just one volley from the rifle.

Plus the Pistol... oh and he almost got Crushed with a Slip Drive.

 

 

Yes and if this can happen to the Chief's Armour then the same could happen to others...

 

What do you think that Covenant Armour systems need not be Repaired or require Replacement parts on occasion? Their Armour and Shielding is good, but not That good.

 

Presumably the Ultra could have had it's Shielding damage in a previous fight. It can happen if it's shields are dropped and then it's shielding matrix is shot... It could still work, but be at reduced strength.

 

We don't know how much battle the Elite in question had seen before advancing upon Rally Point Omega.

[Guest ricrery]

Plus the Pistol... oh and he almost got Crushed with a Slip Drive.

 

Does the pistol have tens of kilojoules of kinetic energy?

 

Yes and if this can happen to the Chief's Armour then the same could happen to others...

 

Look at First Strike page 61 nearly at the end. Apparently an entire pistol clip can defeat the shields of an Elite.

[Skirmisher]

Does the pistol have tens of kilojoules of kinetic energy?

 

Look at First Strike page 61 nearly at the end. Apparently an entire pistol clip can defeat the shields of an Elite.

IDK what the energy is behind the Pistol... due to it's SAPHE ammo it could theoretically act like a HEAT round, and that does far more damage than just Ke.

 

Presumably since 8 to 12 rounds of it are equal to a full clip or more of MA5 rounds, then they do a Hell of alot of Damage.

[Guest ricrery]

Presumably since 8 to 12 rounds of it are equal to a full clip or more of MA5 rounds, then they do a Hell of alot of Damage.

 

And there are only 8 rounds in a clip as well, supporting that they don't have 45 kilojoule bolts.

[Skirmisher]

And there are only 8 rounds in a clip as well, supporting that they don't have 45 kilojoule bolts.

Presumably the Pistol also has 20 to 45 KJ rounds?

 

Realistically Pistols should be Obsolete in settings with Energy Shields...

[Guest ricrery]

Presumably the Pistol also has 20 to 45 KJ rounds?

 

That would mean that the Elite can't survive one second of his own weapon firing at him, literally.

[Skirmisher]

That would mean that the Elite can't survive one second of his own weapon firing at him, literally.

How so? If his shields can take 8+ Plasma Rifle/Pistol hits at 45KJ as seen everywhere... then he could take a hit from his own weapon firing at him.

 

Now if you meant that he couldn't take a hit UNSHIELDED then yes, a Plasma round would probably gut him depending on where it hit. Their Armour is quite resilient...

[Guest ricrery]

How so? If his shields can take 8+ Plasma Rifle/Pistol hits at 45KJ as seen everywhere... then he could take a hit from his own weapon firing at him.

 

But his shields can't tank 8+ 20-45 kJ rounds (which they don't have, in terms of kinetic energy at least). The novel shows that a clip can take down an Elite's shields, cut through his armor, and kill him.

 

Now if you meant that he couldn't take a hit UNSHIELDED then yes, a Plasma round would probably gut him depending on where it hit. Their Armour is quite resilient...

 

You mean the same armor that 7.62x51mm NATO rounds can puncture, right?

[Skirmisher]

But his shields can't tank 8+ 20-45 kJ rounds (which they don't have, in terms of kinetic energy at least). The novel shows that a clip can take down an Elite's shields, cut through his armor, and kill him.

Yeah, for most human weapons it takes about a whole Clip to kill or at least drop an Elites shields.

 

Regardless of how absurd that is based on what the damage the rounds could do...

 

It's just that Bungie had a Pistol that would be a .50 semi-auto doorstop had they taken realism into the equation. Instead they balanced it so that the Pistol could actually work in this setting... how they did that IDK.

 

 

You mean the same armor that 7.62x51mm NATO rounds can puncture, right?

True, but then pretty much any Universes armour (That's not too far out there) would be penetrated by their supped up rounds. And It still takes a couple shots to actually put them down.

[Guest Red Blue Blur]

I would just like to point out that an Elite's shield goes down after one physical strike from an opponent. So essentially if they are hit with anything by the preds then there shields are down. The plasma caster literally destroyed a tower vaporizing it with a single blast. Thats more than enough to take out an Elite. Also armor made of Dlex is highly resistant, very similar to the spartan armor.

 

Again I will state in this setting the preds have the upper hand, it would be different in a large scale war. This set up has the advantage of guerilla style fighting which in every instance I have seen or read goes in favor of the preds.

 

Also the pred in the novel i mentioned defeated 150 soldeirs with massive firepower against one single pred. Even if it was the Thai army thats impressive seeing as how he beat them in just a few hours. I couldnt see a low ranking Elite doing the same.

[Skirmisher]

I would just like to point out that an Elite's shield goes down after one physical strike from an opponent.

Because they can put several tons of force behind their Melee blows. Thrown Weapons don't work like that, and neither do projectile weapons.

 

Presumably if a Yautja were to actually get up to an Elite and were to Melee a Defenseless Elite with a full powered punch then the shields would drop.

 

But the thing is, you are taking Game Mechanics a little to far. Meleeing in the game was Simplified like a lobotomizing someone of an already low IQ... They take absolutely Nothing into account when fighting hand to hand in the game, and treat the attack like a Zero Range projectile. The World doesn't work like that though. If they wanted to make it more realistic, then Melee would probably use a quick time event that pits players against each other in a timed game of rock paper scissors. That would be fun, and more realistic than it is... but even that isn't too close to reality either.

 

 

The plasma caster literally destroyed a tower vaporizing it with a single blast. Thats more than enough to take out an Elite.

Ok, a High Powered Shot could presumably do that. But what's the time it takes to charge that shot? I would imagine that it would take a relative amount of time to charge it as the damage it would output. Larger shots should need longer charge times.

 

 

Also armor made of Dlex is highly resistant, very similar to the spartan armor.

And even Spartan Armour fails after a couple hits. Energy Shielding is the way to go, it protects you from headshots, and things that would otherwise kill you dead.

 

 

Again I will state in this setting the preds have the upper hand, it would be different in a large scale war. This set up has the advantage of guerilla style fighting which in every instance I have seen or read goes in favor of the preds.

Except they are fighting against an opponent that has dealt with Cloaks...

 

Is not hindered by the terrain...

 

And has Motion Radar virtually destroying the Predators advantage of stealth.

 

 

The Preds would have to do a Massive Rethink on their hunting strategy, as Sangheili aren't like humans. They're stronger, and much much more combat orientated in their thinking.

 

As well, rather than Fear of the enemy as you would have with Humans, they would probably evoke an Intense Hatred of the enemy. Cowards that only use Cloak and hide in the shadows, never fighting like Real Warriors.

 

 

Also the pred in the novel i mentioned defeated 150 soldeirs with massive firepower against one single pred. Even if it was the Thai army thats impressive seeing as how he beat them in just a few hours. I couldnt see a low ranking Elite doing the same.

No, you wouldn't because a Low Ranking Elite doesn't have the kind of equipment that Preds just give out to their children...

 

Sangheili have to Earn their equipment, they have to show that they don't need that equipment to become proficient killers. And Besides, if even a low ranking Sangheili warrior was equipped with Cloak, he could do the same thing against the Thai Army.

 

Because against an enemy that has no tech that can see through your cloak, they're easy prey for anything.

[Guest force_echo]

How are Preds stronger than Elites? Elites are stronger than Spartans who can lift 2-3 tons easy, even in the books MC had trouble fighting one unarmed.

 

Why are people comparing Elites to the freaking Thai army? The Elites have tech that nullifies Predator cloaking and are superior to the Thai army in EVERY way. Also, the obliterating the tower thing, not really that special. A fuel Rod gun could do that easy, and it dosen't have to charge anything.

[Guest Red Blue Blur]

1) the problem with your logic is that the pred destroyed the towers in a minute or two. Also other than the plasma caster he only had a glaive and wrist blades that he used.

 

2) He allowed the soldiers to see him and didnt use the cloak to try and strike fear into them. So that eliminates the cloak problem.

 

3) With all the soldiers being able to see him, they used AA guns mounted so they were able to fire at ground targets, multiple grenades and 150 soldiers shooting at him he came away with some scratches and dents in his armor.

 

4) The game is the origin of Halo. Which is were the story came from. The Elites are not brillant strategists. In almost all points of the game they just follow orders of the prophets. The only real Elite warrior was the Arbiter and his sqaud he led.

 

5) The preds are a warrior race. Not just hunters. They dont go out to conquer planets but have defended effeciently many times. As a clan they use guerilla tactics and would be a much more effective fighting force in the jungle. Also in every encounter: books, movies, and games the preds have a device that scrambles radar and radios. The same would happen here.

 

6) Finally the Preds are much more efficent H2H fighters than anything the Elites have demonstrated whether it be games or novels.

 

IN THIS SETTING THE PREDS WILL NOT LOSE.