Ivan

First Corinthians 13:11 Also, yes, this match is a gem. Keep up the excellent work. I don't rate matches, but I rated this one.

(James Woods version of Owlman) Ozymandias: "Only I can save the world, but I'm going to need to murder New York to do it." Owlman: "Dude, there are lots of New Yorks. The only meaningful act would be destroying them all." Ozymandias: "In order to save them?" Owlman: "Yeah, sure, whatever." Ozymandias: "Ok, how do we do it?" Owlman "I did it... 35 minutes ago... OH SNAP." Ozymandias: "Dick."

Shenron couldn't wish away Goku's powers, why would it work on The Scarlet Witch?

Loki turned Thor into a frog once, and it just made him more badass. Remember when Buu got beaten up by chocolate? That plus a big damn hammer. Really, though, the DBZ Universe will be fighting itself- Vegeta kills the villains on principal, Goku starts fighting Shenron, Gotenks goes after Buu, etc etc. Avengers/JLA have a tea party and watch them blow each other up.

Easy man, you're getting all worked up over nothing. Geesh, talk about overreacting. Nobody's saying you can't have an opinion. (See how it feels to be accused of having a reaction you clearly didn't have? It's confusing and frustrating. Try not to do that in the future.)

I knew what you meant, I just thought how often do I get a chance to link to an obscure broadway musical around here?

They're going to try to MAME one another? So... they're buying property next to the other's house and opening a home for Unwed Mothers? Interesting setup.

Wow. I came in here to make a Mark Gruenwald joke, (not that any of you heathens would appreciate it,) because The Gru used to routinely destroy even the most intense fans at Marvel trivia contests, and if you've never read Squadron Supreme you're not really a Marvel Comics fan. Instead I see people bashing Kim Possible, which was easily one of the five best animated series of the past decade. Ugh. You sicken me, CBUB. This is why I don't comment on fights.

I'm a little weary of the phrase "with relative ease" being thrown about in any fight involving these four characters. Lots of people (including guys like Dan Jurgens, who has written appearances for all these characters in Marvel and DC,) would say this is a very even fight. Gladiator and Thor don't give up easily. I'm not saying they'll win, just that it's going to be a very long, arduous battle that can in no way be described as a victory "with relative ease."

I have nothing to contribute except Whatever Knows Fear Burns at The Man Thing's Touch!

The FPL has had a few get-togethers over its 15(ish) year lifespan. Those friendships have developed gradually, over time, working together on story stuff, chatting on IRC, playing D&D over Skype, etc. (It should also be noted that the average age in the FPL is over 21, while the average age in the CBUB seems to be under 18.) Two out of the four times I've gone to Vegas have been with FPL folks, and I've been lucky enough to live close to a few in the past, so we've been able to do stuff like go out for ramen or beers or bowling or what have you. Bottom line, that is nothing like the situation FoxFingers described. If you don't understand social boundaries, the internet is not the place to learn them, but here's a good starting point: Showing up at someone's house for the first time is always By Invitation Only.

We've had a DGC discussion before, because I didn't remember Alfred being that much more powerful than Haplo, and talking to you made me go re-read some of the books. I almost suggested Fizban/Zifnab, but things get really mucky with that guy.

If you're doing magic, Raistlin might be a good addition. Alfred from the Death Gate Cycle is up there, in terms of power. Maybe Harry Dresden if you were able to give him some kind of equalizing advantage.

Ted Kord.

Cyclops- his entire existence is predicated on his interpretation of Professor Xavier's dream. Without that, Cyclops flounders for a while before joining up with the Doom Patrol Emma Frost- Emma never has trouble ingratiating herself with powerful people. She becomes Lex Luthor's arm candy for a while, until he learns her secret. After that, she becomes a madame in London, and friend to John Constantine. Namor- Namor becomes a recurring Aquaman villain, until he falls in love with Tula, and reforms, becoming Aquaman's personal anti-Superman contingency. Rogue- Rogue begins dating Plastic Man, who is immune to her powers. Hope- Being nothing more than a lame Marvel plot-device, Hope Summers explodes immediately upon entering the DCU. Later people think they spot her, but it turns out to be Everyman. Colossus- Colossus joins the Metal Men. Danger- Recruited by Stormwatch, accidentally killed by The Engineer who tries to upgrade Danger's programming. Although Danger is lost, the Engineer is later able to use the animated body to both go on missions and remain in The Bleed at the same time. Magik- Magik joins the Shadowpact, where she is both respected and well-liked. Gambit- Gambit joins the Suicide Squad, which is really generous because Gambit sucks but I already killed off Hope so I thought I'd throw you a bone. Wolverine- Wolverine moves to Star City, where they'll put up with that kind of thing. He occasionally has a beer with Jack Knight. Iceman- Justice League material. Bobby and Wally develop an ongoing prank war. Nightcrawler- He'd be perfect for Checkmate. Storm- Justice Society welcomes her with open arms. Beast- STAR labs. Box- Umm... does Courtney Whitmore need another sidekick? Nemesis- Killed by Solomon Grundy. Rachel Summers- Accidentally stops an invasion of White Martians, gets tapped to do some deep-space cosmic stuff. X man- Fights the Spectre. Loses. Magneto- Gets permission from Black Adam to set up a mutant protection colony in Khandaq. Eventually Rogue and Cyclops make their way there, the "mutant" status not being something they can let go of as easily as the others. Jubilee- Falls in with Brother Blood. Killed in the short lived "Tim Drake, Vampire Hunter" series. Warpath- learns the secret words "Inuk Chuk." Changes his name and joins the Superfriends. Archangel- Adventures on Hawkworld. Fantomex- Hangs out with Animal Man, where they both talk about how cool Grant Morrison is.

I wish more CBUB matches were like this. I've always thought that "What Would Happen?" is a much more interesting question than "Who Beats Who?" I think Thanos would treat Apocalypse like he did Terrax- recognizing his ability and offering him control of some planet in exchange for subduing some specific target.

I was given to understand that I get five identical generic dudes with five identical sets of skills and powers, who have to learn to operate as a team under the leadership of the trainer. Do you mean I am supposed to pick five already existing fictional characters, and give each one unique powers and skills of other fictional characters? If so, that's... infinitely less interesting. I feel that Karnak's ability to sense weak points is definitely a power, not a skill. If you disagree, or if his Inhuman physiology makes him ineligible, I'll switch to King Peacock which is the same exact thing but more clearly a power, and he's Captain America level physically. I do understand now that the team won't get Taskmaster's photographic reflexes (bummer,) but he's still the ultimate answer in terms of skill set, because having skills is his skill. Also, Grandmaster is still the best choice for trainer- there is literally nobody better at conceiving win/loss scenarios across all manner of competitions. (Because there is no guarantee that this is going to be an out-and-out fight, Training by Stick or Iroh or Muten Roshi or whoever isn't guaranteed to have ANY bearing on the eventual outcome.) Two months training as a team with The Grandmaster would have them winning Battle Royales, Speed Chess, Mojoverse Gameshows, and Lumberjack competitions with equal ease. If I'm supposed to pick five different dudes who already exist, and amp them up with bunches of powers and skills, never mind, I'm out.

I don't see any part of my selection which contravenes anything in that post.

Frank Miller vs Alan Moore? I'll take Alan any day.

An All-Marvel team, for fun: Power set: Karnak Skill Set: Taskmaster Special Item: Smoke bombs and Night vision goggles Trainer: Grandmaster Boost: Panthers' vibranium laced suit, Cap's Shield, Telepathic Link Actually... what are the restrictions on trainers? Grandmaster is kind of the ultimate answer for this, I think. His entire existence is figuring out how to win games, and he'd be able to conceive of incredible strategies on the fly and broadcast them via the Telepathic Link. Meanwhile, with the physical attributes of Karnak, plus his ability to sense weak points, plus Tasky's ability to adopt and execute any opponent strategies on the fly simply by watching them, (not to mention the combined physical skills of the Marvel U's best street-level characters,) throw in an obfuscation item and two amazing defensive items just in case... Yeah Grandmaster might be overdoing it.

1) Lobo has the speed and palate necessary to out-drink Wolverine 2) Wolverine has an advantage, having driven terrestrial vehicles before 3) Wolverine has an advantage, having been a solider, in understanding the rules and tactics of the game 4) Just for clarification, it's spelled "Euchre" 5) Wolverine has an advantage, being from the planet that invented bowling. 6) Lobo has the speed and palate necessary to out-eat Wolverine 7) Wolverine has an advantage, being from the planet that invented baseball 8) Wolverine has an advantage, having driven terrestrial vehicles before 9) Wolverine has an advantage, being from the planet where fish are originally from 10) Wolverine has an advantage, being from the planet where deer, rabbit, pheasant, and coyote are originally from

How about Marvel's Legion of Monsters vs DC's House of Mystery?

Step 1: Find anyone who has read a comic book ever. Step 2: Ask that person to name the members of the Fantastic Four. Step 3: Compare that list to the two teams above. The one that matches is your winner. Honestly, that second team contains four of my most hated characters in comics. They all suck. I hate every version of Venom, but Flash Thompson as a superhero just sucks at its core concept. X-23 sucked the first time in MC2 when she was called Wild Thing, she sucks even harder now. Ghost Rider is kind of the epitome of a godawful character in every incarnation- he was briefly tolerable in the Legion of Monsters, but the closer to Spawn he gets the more he sucks. Red Hulk managed to ruin like the four most pivotal characters in the Hulk mythos in one go, so yeah, he sucks. It's like they cherrypicked the stupidest characters in comics and put them on a team together. All that's missing are Daken and Gambit to make it the official worst team of all time. (current record for worst team of all time held by The Blood Syndicate)

I think, if we're talking about our daily lives, getting Martian Manhunter powers is like getting Superman powers plus a bunch of extra stuff. Sure you wouldn't be *quite* as strong or fast as you could the other way, but you're also going to be freaking strong and fast, and with no Superman to compare it to you might as well be Superman. For me, the shapeshifting/ inbisibility/ intangibility thing sells it right there, I'd take those over strength or flight, but when you throw in strength and flight and telepathy and ill-defined eyeball shooting powers... how could I not go for that? I'm not worried about abusing the powers- Manhunter loses his mojo around fire, and there's plenty of people with access to fire out there. I'd start a global breeding program as quickly as possible and all my myriad superpowered children could help keep me in check. I'd eventually retire, and keep watch over the earth from the Moon while my offspring took over.