TroytheRobot

Hi 

I am Tarvius. 

It almost seems strange theorizing about things like this now. I mean, the site is a "blank slate" so to speak so talk of "we want this and don't do that but you can do this other thing," is really just speculation. I don't even know what my thoughts will be with all this stuff in the future let alone trying to control a site full of people. I'm inclined to take on a relaxed attitude and deal with continuity stuff as it's presented. Like right now I'd much rather prefer people bring new stuff to the table but if that's not the direction the site wants to go in so be it; I can adapt. That's the give and take of the new place for you and sort of what I meant by dropping your preconceived notions. There's going to be a bit of compromise and a bit of push and shove when it comes to establishing continuity.  Like updatedude said it's a new sandbox  and kicking sand at someone and knocking their sandcastle over isn't cool. 

You all give me headaches. 

I would like for most things to be new but I imagine that everyone is going to try and bring their ideas from the FPL into the new place. I would like to see them ingrained properly and rebooted rather than just copied over verbatim. At least try to be a part of the new continuity. Like I'd be cool if Ivan wanted to bring Marjus Voyce over but I'd really prefer if he rebuilt him from scratch to better fit the new place's collaborative continuity. So not just copy/pasting his old character sheet but making "new" Marjus Voyce to better fit this new place. Like he'd have Marjus' essence but he wouldn't be the Marjus Voyce that appears in his current character sheet. That'd be cool with me, but like I said I'd much rather have people bring new characters, new ideas and new stories to the place. 

Nah, I haven't really done anything except for agree with Landon and get too excited about things. Also, there's a group of us working on everything who all deserve credit as well. Although it's mostly Landon (especially if this thing fails, then it's definitely all Landon). 

Thank you for the compliment though. 

Just some friendly advice about the new place without revealing too much about it: 

1. It's a blank slate. We're starting from scratch both in terms of continuity and in terms of site functionality from a technical standpoint. The sooner you drop any preconceived notions about what you think will happen in terms of story or how similar you want it to be to the current FPL and realize that we're starting fresh the better. 

2. We're not moving the FPL. I can say with some amount of certainty that the new place is hardly anything like the current incarnation of the FPL. Like I said it's a new idea, yes we've carried over elements of the FPL but it's a completely new format. 

3. Collaboration is key. With the new systems, open lines of creative communication are key to the sites functionality. Sure you can isolate yourself and just create for yourself and not worrying about anyone else but that wont help the site nor will it really contribute to anything. Besides I think you'll have a lot more fun if you work with other creators. 

4. Give it time. We're trying a lot of new things here. Likewise we're working with new programs that we're not 100% familiar with. It's going to take time to get up to speed. Just give it a chance

5. Let Khazan die a noble death. Khazan has been picked at, probed, twisted, pestered, molded, and sculpted by the masterful minds of the FPL since 1999. It has had enough. (See advice #1)

6. Conceptual creativity is king when it comes to character sheets. This will make a lot more sense once you guys have a chance to see the new place. 

I'm in support of Landon's idea and am willing to help in any way possible. 

HALLELUJAH! 

A separate place for the FPL

My last comment wasn't meant to stop anyone from discussing or resolving this issue. I'm obviously not going to stop people from going to other places or making other plans. I just meant to say that that's what I'm doing for the issue. I'm not even sure if anything I'm doing will come to anything. As for everyone else you have to make your own path with this issue. Just thought I should clear that up. 

Good luck to everyone 

Tarv will feel you in. This little iPhone is annoying to hold long conversations. Until later.

I will do no such thing. 

Seriously though, the appropriate conversations with the right people will take place. No plans have been put into motion as of yet, just talking. 

We should just have a Goku vs Superman tournament. 

Was actually thinking about getting back into the FPL recently, if you're making changes it seems like an even better idea. I don't have suggestions off the top of my head but I'll use this as a placeholder in case anything comes up.

[Placeholder for all the ideas Tarvius wont have]

Seems like a pretty cool idea.

I give you a thumbs up treacheroo

Just some general information for all who are interested:

Feel free to use this part of the board to create and conduct your own CBUB related tournaments, challenges, write-offs etc. etc. I can't imagine it'll see much use from me personally but if you want to battle it out with another CBUBer in the writing realm go right ahead.

Hi there MMM

Yes, we will have all of the boobs.

Don't listen to him treach

Our guys will have the biggest shiniest guns with the most bullets

The following was sent to me in a PM. Thread briefly reopened:

Didn't even let me respond before you closed the thread. I See how it is.

You can respond here if you like. I'm not interested in continuing a cyclical argument though; what I've said in the topic remains true and like it or not that's simply how the system works. I've never been one for debates, arguments, flamewars (whatever you want to call them). Yet when there comes an opportunity for me (as a site administrator) to explain how the site works I usually take it. So by all means, respond if you wish but I won't be goaded into continuing this conversation.

....

Also, it seems like there are those of you who weren't complete with this discussion. By all means continue beating each other's faces in but personally I've said my piece and I'm done.

The rest of you though, have fun.

And in a moment of triumphant irony, Darkender comes off as being the sensible one.

"L2P or GTFO" - Ivan

If the grammar or spelling is so bad we can't understand it. You might have a point, but I doubt that's what you are saying.

No, that's exactly what I'm saying. If it's not readable it's not really acceptable.

Also, uh you don't need a paragraph to say Batman and Spider-man duke it out on a Chicago street. Hell you don't need that to say who would win in a fight. Nor does one need or at least should not need to know why they are fighting to weigh in on the out come.

You're confusing what's "necessary" with what's a part of the site's actual guidelines. For all intents and purposes, the CBUB is a game. Like all other games there are certain rules that need be followed in order for the system to thrive. Again, it goes back to what I was talking about with acceptable standard of quality. One paragraph of text is the minimal amount required to technically be considered a CBUB set-up; that point really isn't up for debate. Can you ask "Who would win between Batman and Spider-Man?" in less than a paragraph, sure. That's not the issue though, the issue is that a paragraph is what's "needed" for a CBUB match. I'm sorry, but that's just how the site works.

I've been over the problem with the lets use the Rumbles Board as a fall back/scape goat goat thing already.

 

Further how is the rating system a safety net?

And yet, I'm still not sure why you have such an aversion to it. It seems like it's just the thing for someone of your interests. *shrugs*

The rating system, was put in place by Serge to reward those with entertaining set-ups and those who wrote set-ups that were a "crowd favorite". The CBUB, apart from being a game, is also a popularity contest. The rating system, possess a way for members of the site to put their two cents as to the entertainment of the match. In other words, it's a part of the site's guidelines and by extension the CBUB's rules. So the rating system is a method that rewards those members who followed and sometimes went above and beyond the basic guidelines of the site. It is a safety net in the sense that people can maintain relatively anonymous identities while approving/disproving the quality of certain set-ups. In this, "good" matches would be rewarded (they get a higher FPA, more available characters etc. etc.). And those matches that were below the acceptable standard of quality would not receive the same benefits. Again, this goes back to the "game element" of the CBUB.

Basically the second half of your post completely contradicts the first halves attempt at bi-partisanship on the subject. You go from saying. If people just wants who would win, the let'em have it to. You must write set up or die. You go from don't rate people who don't want it to the board needs the rating system to survive.

No, not at all. The entire point of my post was: Do whatever you have the most fun doing, but there are guidelines that the CBUB has. I'm not really sure how's that a contradiction. In order for it to be a contradiction, the two ideas need to be in opposition to one another. If people just want to discuss who would beat who WITHIN THE GUIDELINES OF THE CBUB, then I have no problem with that. When I was talking about if people just wanted to know who would win, I was speaking more to the crowd of reviewers/readers/critics than the actual writers. That whole notion I described above has more to do with forum/debate etiquette than the guidelines of the site, and by extension the necessity of the set-up within the system. Furthermore, as I said before, there's a difference between "critiquing a match" and "using the site's rating system". The former would fall under the definition of being creative leaning while the other is simply a part of the site's mechanics.

In other words your bias is showing.

My "bias" lies in the fact that I know what I'm talking about.

The set-up is a part of the site's acceptable standard of quality. The FPL has standards, and believe it or not the CBUB does too. It's all a part of how the "game" actually works.

And with all do respect. You lost it.

Care to tell me what you disagree with?

If the issue at hand really is whether or not peer critiques are a necessary part of the CBUB process, I really don't see a problem. While people like RiotGear may simply enjoy discussing "who beats who" in a very clear-cut manner that's up to them. I mean, I may not agree with this sentiment myself, but going back to my other post, different members are here for different reasons. For some of us, this IS a writing site. For others, this site exist as an outlet for debate. So, to me at least, it's really foolish to sit there and tell the other guy that this site is or isn't something. For example, to me this is a writing site. It always has been for me but I respect the fact that others may not see it as so.

Now back to the matter at hand, if we are to believe that this portion of the site is truly divided between those that argue for the mechanics of the match and those who are here as a creative outlet then it really doesn't make sense for one group to make demands of the other. If a person wants to make a set-up just to see if Predator would beat Blackheart in a poker match, and they're not here for writing advice; there's really no reason that other members should be bombarding him with writing critiques. It's a different case, if the person right out says "What do you think of my set-up? What did you like about it? What didn't you like about it?" then there is an obvious call for criticism. Yet, if the person just wants to discuss power levels there's really no reason to beat his head in for not being a creative well-thought out match. Again, personally, I would much rather see the creative, well-thought out match; I don't give a damn about power levels.

So if you know that the person is more creative leaning or they ask you to critique their writing , then feel free to offer whatever mutual advice you may have. On the other hand, if they don't expressly entail their interest in improving their writing skills, just stay out of it.

That being said, for both of these groups certain guidelines need to be followed; some by unwritten mores of the site itself, and some because they simply don't make sense not to. First of all, the set-ups need to at least be readable. No, this is not meant to insult those of you who do not have English as their native language but there comes a point where one needs to say, "This is grammatically unacceptable." Again, I'm not poking fun at those of you who are grammatically inefficient (for whatever reason), and I'm not expecting you to be perfect but there comes a time when it is your duty as a site community to say that such brutalizations of grammar are not acceptable.

Secondly, there are certain guidelines that a CBUB match NEEDS to have in order for it to be technically following the rules. I know these were written in the previous server's version of the site and I'm not sure they still exist. Anyways, here they are for those of you who are interested:

1.) Setting

2.) At least one paragraph in length

3.) A reason why the members of the match are in conflict with one another

If you don't feel like doing even that minimal amount, feel free to use the Rumble board as previously suggested.

Finally, the site's built in rating system (It's good, It's ok, It's bad) does not count as an actual critique, but as a technical measure designed to keep the site from crashing in on itself. It's really more of a safety net/reward system than a writing critique tool. Because honestly, you cant offer constructive criticism simply by going, "this is terrible!!" So, the use of those ratings isn't REALLY an issue here.

I hope this helps.

So let's pretend like I'd actually write the following idea and wouldn't just completely forget about it in a day or two. Let's also pretend that Treacherous actually wanted me to write something for this:

I'd like to offer up Piotr from treach's tournament for this Fallen team. He really is a Fallen character anyways and with Knox coming off as a double agent between the Fallen and The Sentinels (at least that's what it looks like to me), I feel like he'd fit in fairly well with this continuity.

It could be very well that I am not wanted in this storyline, which is perfectly fine with me and I'll hold no ill will towards anyone but treacherous (that's just my job). However, I'd just like to say the offer is on the table and I'm willing to be a part of this if wanted.

How long was it before you departed for the FPL, Tarv? Your reasons for enjoying making CBUB matches are so close to mne, it's scary. Could it be my destiny to join the FPL someday? Probably not, since making my own characters rather than using ones that already exist sounds like a daunting task. But who knows. I never thought I'd be writing fictional stories on the internet to begin with, and here I am.

I was on the CBUB for roughly nine months before I decided to leave that portion of the site altogether. Although, the interest had faded long before that. Also, I wouldn't exactly say I'm an FPLer per se. If you're definition of an FPLer is someone who makes FPL characters, then no I am not one of those people. The entire time I've been here I've only submitted two characters, both of which suck horribly. However, if by "FPLer" you mean someone who plots stories without ever actually finishing them while offering passing conceptual ideas to the continuity of the site and offers others rare critiques on the CA board; then yes, I would have to say that I'm an FPLer.

As a final note, if you're serious about joining the FPL and you need a hand just let me know. I'd be glad to get you someone who knows what they're talking about.

The CBUB, like every other facet of this site, means different things to different people. In that regard, it's nearly impossible to say the CBUB is for one purpose or another. Both RiotGear and DSKillz believed that the CBUB had different, while not entirely contradictory purposes. I mean, a lot of the debate seems to be focused on "this is what you should do" vs. "that is unnecessary, this is just for fun." Though, I disagree with both of you on some parts I can't say I agree entirely with any one party. Why? Because I can't speak for the entire mass of CBUBers to say why they use the site. All I can really offer is why I was initially interested in the CBUB.

My initial interest in the CBUB was in fact from a writing stand point. I wasn't necessarily interested in the power mechanics of what would happen if Character A fought Character B. Sure I could have a conversation every now and then on whether or not Cyclops' optic beams could blast through Captain America's shield but not enough to hold my attention for more than a brief conversation every now and then. To me, the CBUB offered a chance for members to take on the role as the writer of their favorite comic/movie/video game. It's like you had the chance to take characters with dozens of years of history and add your twist, your own creative flair to the character's story. I suppose you could say that I was more interested in telling a good story about why these characters were at conflict with one another, rather than getting opinions on the combative efficiencies/deficiencies of either character. That's what CBUB meant for ME, personally, I can't speak for anybody else. So, when the majority of the CBUB seemed to become more interested in feats, scans, power levels etc. etc. it played a huge role in my decision to leave that part of the site.

However, despite all this M. Bison put it best. Do whatever you have the most fun doing.

Side-note about Serge's comment regarding the FPL: The original concept may have been to discuss power combinations but the people who defined the FPL throughout it's 10+ year history will tell you that the FPL is a creative writing branch of Electric Ferret. Site ideas evolve and change based on how their members react. Same can be said about the CBUB and I don't really see anything wrong with that.