Hunger Games: Bad Guy Brawl

[Indolent]

Actually, I forget which issues, but in the Wolverine and the X-Men Series, he's literally hired by the new Hellfire Club to literally *vulgarity* with Wolverine and gives the Club info on how to do so as well - he's anything but an imbecile - he's highly intelligent (He's capable of hacking into high end agencies as well), and has plotted out means to messing with and defeating Wolverine aside from straight up destroying his shit. >.>

[kainboa]

Snip

 

Funny, that's what I always thought about you.

 

Very well, then please give some examples of where I've said something that was factually wrong, rather than merely a difference in opinion.

 

Since in this particular case, I will be showing that I do know what I'm talking about when I claim that Sabretooth isn't stupid, nor incapable of taking a stealthy approach, whereas you thus far haven't done anything other than showcasing your rather blatant ignorance in regards to the same.

 

I don't get your point.

 

Okay, so reading comprehension isn't one of your strong points either, I'll rephrase slightly, and hopefully you'll be able to grasp the point.

 

"I will include a scan, which shows Sabretooth messing around with Wolverine, rather than taking the direct approach, to show the fact that he is capable of taking a stealthy approach."

 

I hope that this rephrasing wasn't too complicated for you to understand, but if you still don't get the point, I don't mind rephrasing it again.

 

Is he intelligent because he shoved Wasabi up Wolverine's nose, when he has extensive knowledge and experience with how Wolverine's sense of smell works? Awesome, that puts him at... The stupidest person here.

 

No, the scans weren't about his intelligence, they were about Sabretooth being stealthy and drawing wolverine out, rather than simply engaging him directly.

 

Since you apparently didn't look at anything beyond the first scan, I'll summarize.

 

Sabretooth puts Wasabi up Wolverines nose to prevent him from finding Kitty Pryde and Mariko, then retreats. He then goes on to utilize a ninja-suit, along with several puppets, in order to draw Wolverine to the place of his choice, where upon he engages him.

 

If he was as prone to a direct assault as you claimed, he would have simply engaged Wolverine in combat from the beginning, but he didn't.

 

Another example of the same, is when he escapes from the X-mansion, and rather than directly confront Bishop, he hides and waits in an ambush.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop2.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop3.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop4.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop5.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop6.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop7.jpg

 

Yet another example of the same is when he ambushes and defeats the X-factor team one by one, rather than simply engaging them directly.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor_v1_136_12_rougher.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor1.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor3.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor4.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor5.jpg

 

So, to summarize, in the first scan I showed, we've seen Sabretooth utilizing stealth to draw wolverine to a predetermined spot. In the second, he's using stealth to ambush Bishop, and in the third he's using stealth to defeat the X-factor.

 

All of these goes rather contrary to your claim of Sabretooth not using stealth.

 

He's an idiot, that very comic arc you're referencing he was being controlled by Romulus/Weapon X. He would like nothing more than to shred Wolverine into little pieces in a direct fight (as demonstrated the first time Wolverine "killed" Sabretooth) but he's being led on by people smarter than he is.

 

You keep trying to make an argument about Sabretooth being stupid, by utilizing the first scan I showed, as your counter proof, when the scan wasn't to showcase his intelligence in the first place.

 

The only argument I gave about Sabretooth not being stupid, was that the only reason one would make such a statement, is a lack of knowledge about the character.

Given your argument, I can only come to the conclusion, which was rather obvious from your initial statement, that you don't really know much about him.

 

I'll educate you a bit then.

 

Over the course of a single fight, he deduces that Daredevil is blind.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-13.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-14.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-15.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-16.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-17.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-18.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-19.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-20.jpg

 

Hardly something an idiot would be capable of.

 

Another example of his cunning is when he manipulates Boom Boom into releasing him from his restraints.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/17.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/18.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/19-1.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/20.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/21.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/22.jpg

 

He hacks into a government database, again not something an idiot would be capable of.

 

Minor side note here, there are two different scans, showing this particular point.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/hacker.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/hacker3.jpg

 

He deduces that some creations of Sinister are telepathic, and then using a device given to him by his employers, to projects his mind into them, in order to take them out.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills2.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills3.jpg

 

You don't know what you're talking about, even in the damn scans, he lets Wolverine come up close to him, fight, and then begins to piss him off out of spite.

 

Funny, first off, you claim that I don't know what I'm talking about, when your claims, namely Sabretooth being stupid and apparently incapable of taking a stealthy approach, has been dis-proven on multiple occasions.

 

Secondly, the fact that he engages Wolverine in H2H combat at the end, doesn't negate the fact that he kept away from Wolverine previously, and lured him to that particular spot.

 

Yeah, that definitely shows that he's not arrogant, good debating Kain.

 

First off, I haven't said anything about Sabretooth being arrogant or not.

 

From what I know, claiming that your opponent has said something which they haven't, isn't exactly considered stellar debating, but I guess where you're from such behaviour is looked upon as proper.

 

Secondly, I've now quite clearly shown, that Sabretooth is more than capable of taking a stealthy approach, and that he is far from an idiot, which rather nicely proves my initial points.

[Guest Lunacyde]

Actually, I forget which issues, but in the Wolverine and the X-Men Series, he's literally hired by the new Hellfire Club to literally *vulgarity* with Wolverine and gives the Club info on how to do so as well - he's anything but an imbecile - he's highly intelligent (He's capable of hacking into high end agencies as well), and has plotted out means to messing with and defeating Wolverine aside from straight up destroying his shit. >.>

 

Not to point out the obvious, but isn't that more of a feat demonstrating his intimate knowledge of Wolverine than pure intelligence?

 

 

Also, whoever said creed would destroy the weapons....most of them are made of adamantium

[Bergy_Berg]

Also, whoever said creed would destroy the weapons....most of them are made of adamantium

The melee weapons are, but the guns and even the bows have no mention of such. The most dangerous thing for anyone going up against Creed to have is one of the guns. If Creed takes his pick of ranged weaponry, and then breaks the rest of the guns, everyone else is at an incredible disadvantage.

[Guest force_echo]

Funny, that's what I always thought about you.

 

Very well, then please give some examples of where I've said something that was factually wrong, rather than merely a difference in opinion.

 

Since in this particular case, I will be showing that I do know what I'm talking about when I claim that Sabretooth isn't stupid, nor incapable of taking a stealthy approach, whereas you thus far haven't done anything other than showcasing your rather blatant ignorance in regards to the same.

 

I don't get your point.

 

Okay, so reading comprehension isn't one of your strong points either, I'll rephrase slightly, and hopefully you'll be able to grasp the point.

 

"I will include a scan, which shows Sabretooth messing around with Wolverine, rather than taking the direct approach, to show the fact that he is capable of taking a stealthy approach."

 

I hope that this rephrasing wasn't too complicated for you to understand, but if you still don't get the point, I don't mind rephrasing it again.

 

Is he intelligent because he shoved Wasabi up Wolverine's nose, when he has extensive knowledge and experience with how Wolverine's sense of smell works? Awesome, that puts him at... The stupidest person here.

 

No, the scans weren't about his intelligence, they were about Sabretooth being stealthy and drawing wolverine out, rather than simply engaging him directly.

 

Since you apparently didn't look at anything beyond the first scan, I'll summarize.

 

Sabretooth puts Wasabi up Wolverines nose to prevent him from finding Kitty Pryde and Mariko, then retreats. He then goes on to utilize a ninja-suit, along with several puppets, in order to draw Wolverine to the place of his choice, where upon he engages him.

 

If he was as prone to a direct assault as you claimed, he would have simply engaged Wolverine in combat from the beginning, but he didn't.

 

Another example of the same, is when he escapes from the X-mansion, and rather than directly confront Bishop, he hides and waits in an ambush.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop2.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop3.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop4.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop5.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop6.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/bishop7.jpg

 

Yet another example of the same is when he ambushes and defeats the X-factor team one by one, rather than simply engaging them directly.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor_v1_136_12_rougher.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor1.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor3.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor4.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/xfactor5.jpg

 

So, to summarize, in the first scan I showed, we've seen Sabretooth utilizing stealth to draw wolverine to a predetermined spot. In the second, he's using stealth to ambush Bishop, and in the third he's using stealth to defeat the X-factor.

 

All of these goes rather contrary to your claim of Sabretooth not using stealth.

 

He's an idiot, that very comic arc you're referencing he was being controlled by Romulus/Weapon X. He would like nothing more than to shred Wolverine into little pieces in a direct fight (as demonstrated the first time Wolverine "killed" Sabretooth) but he's being led on by people smarter than he is.

 

You keep trying to make an argument about Sabretooth being stupid, by utilizing the first scan I showed, as your counter proof, when the scan wasn't to showcase his intelligence in the first place.

 

The only argument I gave about Sabretooth not being stupid, was that the only reason one would make such a statement, is a lack of knowledge about the character.

Given your argument, I can only come to the conclusion, which was rather obvious from your initial statement, that you don't really know much about him.

 

I'll educate you a bit then.

 

Over the course of a single fight, he deduces that Daredevil is blind.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-13.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-14.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-15.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-16.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-17.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-18.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-19.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Daredevil_238-20.jpg

 

Hardly something an idiot would be capable of.

 

Another example of his cunning is when he manipulates Boom Boom into releasing him from his restraints.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/17.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/18.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/19-1.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/20.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/21.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/22.jpg

 

He hacks into a government database, again not something an idiot would be capable of.

 

Minor side note here, there are two different scans, showing this particular point.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/hacker.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/hacker3.jpg

 

He deduces that some creations of Sinister are telepathic, and then using a device given to him by his employers, to projects his mind into them, in order to take them out.

 

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills2.jpg

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/supermenowneddeductiveskills3.jpg

 

You don't know what you're talking about, even in the damn scans, he lets Wolverine come up close to him, fight, and then begins to piss him off out of spite.

 

Funny, first off, you claim that I don't know what I'm talking about, when your claims, namely Sabretooth being stupid and apparently incapable of taking a stealthy approach, has been dis-proven on multiple occasions.

 

Secondly, the fact that he engages Wolverine in H2H combat at the end, doesn't negate the fact that he kept away from Wolverine previously, and lured him to that particular spot.

 

Yeah, that definitely shows that he's not arrogant, good debating Kain.

 

First off, I haven't said anything about Sabretooth being arrogant or not.

 

From what I know, claiming that your opponent has said something which they haven't, isn't exactly considered stellar debating, but I guess where you're from such behaviour is looked upon as proper.

 

Secondly, I've now quite clearly shown, that Sabretooth is more than capable of taking a stealthy approach, and that he is far from an idiot, which rather nicely proves my initial points.

Are you serious? Try any time you've ever debated me before. 98% of the time you're wrong, and 100% of the time you're attempts to personally irk the other dude provide good entertainment in the process.

 

Except that that scan doesn't show Sabretooth's dealings with a normal opponent, he's personally trying to irk Wolverine, under Romulus' command (I've said all this before, but I guess you have trouble understanding, it's ok buddy, I'm used to it by now). He's always under someone else's command, he's quite literally, a tool. Yeah, not the trait of an intelligent man. Also, during Wolverine Origins, and Wolverine V 2 #44, and Wolverine's first encounter where he "killed" Sabretooth, Sabretooth basically just goes up to him and starts clawing away. For every one instance you show me of him attempting to ambush someone or use stealth, I have 3 of him straight up beserker-clawing people. Also, try every time he was seen in Weapon X or the CIA (the time when he had to assassinate a Russian scientist and just started clawing through the facility and fighting Omega Red is a good example). The time he fought Iron Fist in IF 14, the time he fought Spider-Man in ASM 116, the time he fought Black Cat (he was beaten btw). What about the time he fought the Morlocks, his stealthy strategy which included.... Oh yeah, run into the sewers and start clawing the shit out of everyone, that's right. Or when he tried to assassinate Xavier. He had an entire TEAM and basically unlimited prep time and he still couldn't take down DEADPOOL ffs.

 

You mean failing to ambush Bishop lol. What's the context/issue number for this?

 

He was being controlled by Valerie Cooper, who installed him as a sleeper agent into X-Factor so he can take out the X-Factor members the US Govt. couldn't control. They came up with the plan, not Creed, that's not his own volition. Also, considering he has been on the team, these are people he intimately knows, like the case with Wolverine, this is not representative here, where he has no personal history or knowledge with any of the combatants. In this case, he'll likely be overconfident and attack up front. Also, my argument was that the vast majority of the time, he would not use stealth, especially in a situation like this. You have failed to prove anything.

 

Bullseye and Typhoid Mary were also able to discern that fact in one fight, and they aren't exactly tactical geniuses. Also, Daredevil won that fight, I think you ought to find a better example. Even if he did discern that, he obviously wasn't smart enough to manipulate it into an advantage. Also, the fight was in the dark, and Sabretooth heard Daredevil sniffing, it doesn't take a freaking genius to piece that together. Seriously, if these are your best feats of Sabretooth's intelligence, I repeat, that puts him at the dumbest guy here.

 

Are you kidding? I could manipulate Boom Boom into letting me out of those restraints, especially since she's been seeking comfort in nursing a lobotomized me and confiding in me (against the advice of literally everyone else ont he team). Hell, under those circumstances, any idiot could persuade her to let him out of his cell.

 

The second scan definitely does not show hacking lol. Also, hacking a computer is cool and all, but it's not very useful in a fight. I'm very well aware that Sabretooth has some hidden intelligence (according to some writers), but that intelligence in a fight is covered by his "extreme arrogance and bestial nature" in a fight, so it doesn't really do him a whole lot of good.

 

I'm not really sure how deducing that clones that are supposed to have all of the powers of the X-Men also have telepathy is impressive (and then getting the government to help actually exploit that weakness). It seems like common sense, especially if you know anything at all about Sinister and his fascination with Jean Gray (which Sabretooth does, since he's worked with Sinister extensively).

 

Ok, well then failing to address your opponents points in any way is still bad debating. The fact that Creed is arrogant and he doesn't know the combatants very well (an element that's not present in any of your scans by the way) suggests what? If you're too stupid to understand (probable), then I'll spell it out.

[xLEGACYx]

*looks down and shakes head*  

 

And there you go proving Kainboa right again.  You are arguing against a point he wasnt trying to make.

 

Hoorah!!!

[Guest force_echo]

*looks down and shakes head*  

 

And there you go proving Kainboa right again.  You are arguing against a point he wasnt trying to make.

 

Hoorah!!!

Really? By proving that Sabretooth is stupid and not prone to use stealth, especially in this situation? Do you know how to read?

[Indolent]

Not to point out the obvious, but isn't that more of a feat demonstrating his intimate knowledge of Wolverine than pure intelligence?

 

 

Also, whoever said creed would destroy the weapons....most of them are made of adamantium

 

Yes and as per Kain's demonstration, that would also be a viable additional instance of intelligence since he's also training the Leader of the Hellfire Club on how to deal with Wolverine, who's the Headmaster of the Jean Grey School - so while it intricately demonstrates familiarity with Wolverine, it also demonstrates he's not an imbecile brute. Not an idiot would you say?

[Guest force_echo]

Yes and as per Kain's demonstration, that would also be a viable additional instance of intelligence since he's also training the Leader of the Hellfire Club on how to deal with Wolverine, who's the Headmaster of the Jean Grey School - so while it intricately demonstrates familiarity with Wolverine, it also demonstrates he's not an imbecile brute. Not an idiot would you say?

It doesn't demonstrate intelligence at all. Some idiot who's just really into comics can instruct a particle physicist on comics. It doesn't mean that the idiot is smart at all, it just indicates more knowledge in one specific area.

[Indolent]

I'll also repeat myself again - he was hired to mess with Wolverine aside training the Hellfire Club. Which isn't a different vein from Kain's demonstration

[xLEGACYx]

DOWN GOES ECHO! DOWN GOES ECHO!

 

1... 2... 3...4... 5... 6... 7... 8... 9... 10!

[Guest force_echo]

 

I'll also repeat myself again - he was hired to mess with Wolverine aside training the Hellfire Club. Which isn't a different vein from Kain's demonstration

You're right, both demonstrations have no significance in this battle.

 

Also, I never said Creed doesn't have the ability to use stealth (another fail with basic argumentation and reading comprehension) but he has used straight tactics far more than stealth oriented ones in his history, especially with foes he doesn't have a history with, because he's arrogant (as Kain proved), he thinks himself better.

[Guest bigballerju]

Sabretooth doesn't have the ability to use stealth? The man use to be a spy, C.I.A agent, weapon x agent, and more. He has that training and close if not equal to the same amount as Wolverine. Sabretooth is just as good a hunter and tracker as Wolverine. To do that requires stealth and intelligence in certain ways of hunting your ignoring. Intelligence is required in hunting your prey and taking the time to track it down. All stuff we have seen Sabretooth do. You can't just ignore all of that.  Also Sabretooth is intelligent hence the hacking into government agencies. You have ignored that to do a feat requires very good intelligence to even be able to figure all that out. Intelligence we know for a fact he has since he performed the feat.

[Indolent]

Given that he's in a setting that consists of purely a fight to the death with threat of death himself aside the lack of his healing factor (his healing factor is the primary reason why Creed can go in balls deep often) - with the lack of it, it goes without saying much that he's more liable to fall back on safer, efficient means guaranteed to prevent harm to himself and kill his opponents.

 

So yes, both demonstrations do have a significance in this battle.

[Guest force_echo]

Given that he's in a setting that consists of purely a fight to the death with threat of death himself aside the lack of his healing factor (his healing factor is the primary reason why Creed can go in balls deep often) - with the lack of it, it goes without saying much that he's more liable to fall back on safer, efficient means guaranteed to prevent harm to himself and kill his opponents.

 

So yes, both demonstrations do have a significance in this battle.

It doesn't "go without saying" for anyone who marginally knows Creed's character. He's going to think he can still take out everyone without his healing factor (something I'm saying for the third time now). I mean come on, he still thinks he can take Wolverine despite Wolverine straight up killing him at least twice, even when Wolverine had Carbonadium weapons, so it has nothing to do with the healing factor. And all it takes is one slip-up for Sabretooth to get killed, and he's playing in a field where nearly everyone is tactically smarter than him. Someone like Bane could draw him out, and then blam. Hole through the head.

[Guest force_echo]

Sabretooth doesn't have the ability to use stealth? The man use to be a spy, C.I.A agent, weapon x agent, and more. He has that training and close if not equal to the same amount as Wolverine. Sabretooth is just as good a hunter and tracker as Wolverine. To do that requires stealth and intelligence in certain ways of hunting your ignoring. Intelligence is required in hunting your prey and taking the time to track it down. All stuff we have seen Sabretooth do. You can't just ignore all of that.  Also Sabretooth is intelligent hence the hacking into government agencies. You have ignored that to do a feat requires very good intelligence to even be able to figure all that out. Intelligence we know for a fact he has since he performed the feat.

If you've ever read Sabretooth while he was a Weapon X or CIA Agent, he was never the leader or strategizer, he was there as a blunt tool, and to keep Wolverine antagonized, Wolverine was always the one in control. So, if you actually read the comics instead of reading a wikipedia summary, you could actually seem to know what you're talking about. And it's funny, because in that same hacking scan, a guy who'd been a Weapon X Controller for years, and who is very familiar with Sabretooth's combat abilities, remarks that he's a complete idiot. Hacking into a computer is not a combat intelligence feat anyway, as I've already said.

[kainboa]

snip

 

Are you serious? Try any time you've ever debated me before. 98% of the time you're wrong, and 100% of the time you're attempts to personally irk the other dude provide good entertainment in the process.

 

Considering the apparently vast number of times I've been factually incorrect in a debate with you, then you shouldn't have a hard time providing some evidence to support your claim, since you didn't I can only consider this as a concession of my point, since a good debater typically provides evidence for the claims he's made when asked for them, rather than giving some bullshit answer and hoping that his opponent will simply ignore the point.

 

The second scan definitely does not show hacking lol.

 

I can only guess that you need to get some new glasses or contacts, since the second scan shows hacking to the same degree that the first one does, I've taken the liberty to do a minor edit to the scan, and circle the area you've quite obviously missed in your perusal.

 

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/kain_boa/hacking_zps00fd8a83.jpg

 

Also, hacking a computer is cool and all, but it's not very useful in a fight. I'm very well aware that Sabretooth has some hidden intelligence (according to some writers), but that intelligence in a fight is covered by his "extreme arrogance and bestial nature" in a fight, so it doesn't really do him a whole lot of good.

 

By your own admission here, you agree that Sabretooth isn't stupid, which is what the argument has been about from the beginning, whether or not his particular intelligence will be of any use to him in this fight, is a completely different argument.

 

You simply made a blanket statement, claiming that he is stupid, which is blatantly incorrect, and which I pointed out, you're now by trying to shift the argument into his intelligence not being useful in a fight.

 

Ok, well then failing to address your opponents points in any way is still bad debating.

 

I disagreed with two of your four points about Sabretooth, namely him being stupid, and apparently incapable of taking a stealthy approach when necessary, which I addressed in my intial post.

 

I agree with you in the two other points, namely him being arrogant, and aggressive, I would've thought it fairly obvious since I didn't say anything about those two points, but since you obviously need to have it spelled out, I've obliged you.

 

With my original post and the follow up post, I have addressed the points you've brought up, while you've neglected to provide evidence for any of your points thus far, yet you keep claiming that I am the bad debater, the irony is rather entertaining.

 

Considering your debating behaviour thus far, namely falsely trying to claim that I've said something which I haven't and now goal posting, I'm not going to respond any further, since trying to engage in a debate with a dishonest opponent, is a waste of time.

[Guest force_echo]

Are you serious? Try any time you've ever debated me before. 98% of the time you're wrong, and 100% of the time you're attempts to personally irk the other dude provide good entertainment in the process.

 

Considering the apparently vast number of times I've been factually incorrect in a debate with you, then you shouldn't have a hard time providing some evidence to support your claim, since you didn't I can only consider this as a concession of my point, since a good debater typically provides evidence for the claims he's made when asked for them, rather than giving some bullshit answer and hoping that his opponent will simply ignore the point.

 

The second scan definitely does not show hacking lol.

 

I can only guess that you need to get some new glasses or contacts, since the second scan shows hacking to the same degree that the first one does, I've taken the liberty to do a minor edit to the scan, and circle the area you've quite obviously missed in your perusal.

 

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b381/kain_boa/hacking_zps00fd8a83.jpg

 

Also, hacking a computer is cool and all, but it's not very useful in a fight. I'm very well aware that Sabretooth has some hidden intelligence (according to some writers), but that intelligence in a fight is covered by his "extreme arrogance and bestial nature" in a fight, so it doesn't really do him a whole lot of good.

 

By your own admission here, you agree that Sabretooth isn't stupid, which is what the argument has been about from the beginning, whether or not his particular intelligence will be of any use to him in this fight, is a completely different argument.

 

You simply made a blanket statement, claiming that he is stupid, which is blatantly incorrect, and which I pointed out, you're now by trying to shift the argument into his intelligence not being useful in a fight.

 

Ok, well then failing to address your opponents points in any way is still bad debating.

 

I disagreed with two of your four points about Sabretooth, namely him being stupid, and apparently incapable of taking a stealthy approach when necessary, which I addressed in my intial post.

 

I agree with you in the two other points, namely him being arrogant, and aggressive, I would've thought it fairly obvious since I didn't say anything about those two points, but since you obviously need to have it spelled out, I've obliged you.

 

With my original post and the follow up post, I have addressed the points you've brought up, while you've neglected to provide evidence for any of your points thus far, yet you keep claiming that I am the bad debater, the irony is rather entertaining.

 

Considering your debating behaviour thus far, namely falsely trying to claim that I've said something which I haven't and now goal posting, I'm not going to respond any further, since trying to engage in a debate with a dishonest opponent, is a waste of time.

Alright, it should be fine for you to find an example then. Go ahead. Find one. It's funny how you can't practice what you preach.

 

Yeah, when I clicked it the first time, it was a scan of a girl and an alligator with sabretooth coming up on them both. That's why I was confused.

 

Are you retarded? I submit, to your immense intelligence, that this scenario is a freaking fight. When I said he was stupid, I didn't care if he knew how to hack a damn computer (that scan says he hacked it with the codes, that's not hacking, that's just using a password you already have, I do the same thing every time I log onto my computer, so I guess I'm as smart in a fight as all of these guys), I was talking about in the context of the fight. Whether he's smart in a fight isn't a different argument, that's the WHOLE argument, and, like I've already said, I NEVER said that Sabretooth was incapable of using stealth, so your idiotic practice of debating things irrelevant in any way, shape, or form to the fight also extends to the fact that you debate things that aren't even important.

 

Yes I need to have it spelled out, just like you need to have it spelled out that when I was talking about Sabretooth being dumb, I was talking about the fight, which is why I was commenting on the FIGHT, something that's so painstakingly obvious, but here. let me spell it out carefully, so you'll understand, when I made the point earlier that Sabretooth's hacking skills won't help him in this fight, I wasn't making it for my health, or because I like arguing with boneheaded imbeciles, I was making it because my claim was in the context of the battle I commented on.

 

I actually responded to EVERY single of your claims buddy. And instead of pulling scans from a respect thread, I actually provided context to the comics you blindly referenced. None of your "points" are valid in this debate because you apparently debate things outside of the context of the fight that I was debating, which obviously doesn't make any damn sense. I don't know about "dishonest", I just think you're stupid. I would much rather debate with someone dishonest than someone who debates completely irrelevant points. If you can even call that debating.

[Guest thanosisawesome]

This isn't really my debate, but still.

Alright, it should be fine for you to find an example then. Go ahead. Find one. It's funny how you can't practice what you preach.

 

That's not really how it works. I'm assuming that he doesn't believe your unsubstantiated claim, so it is up to you to find evidence, which I would assume doesn't exist.

 

 

 (that scan says he hacked it with the codes, that's not hacking, that's just using a password you already have, I do the same thing every time I log onto my computer, so I guess I'm as smart in a fight as all of these guys),

 

A minor point, but from my interpretation Sabertooth acquired said codes through the hacking.

[Guest force_echo]

This isn't really my debate, but still.

 

That's not really how it works. I'm assuming that he doesn't believe your unsubstantiated claim, so it is up to you to find evidence, which I would assume doesn't exist.

 

 

 

A minor point, but from my interpretation Sabertooth acquired said codes through the hacking.

Actually, if you actually read, before butting in like some idiot, he's the one who made the claim first without any evidence. So, if anything, the burden's on him. The only "proof" he had was this very debate. Heads up, it doesn't work like that. You can't use the current contention as evidence for the claim. That's like someone on trial for murder for killing a store owner, and the prosecutor says that he has the capability to commit murder because he committed murder in killing the store owner.

 

Not that it changes the point of my rant at all, but I was under the impression that he used the codes to dig up files on Wolverine, and that was the hacking. Also, how are the only times Creed hacks into the Weapon X databases solely to get information on Wolverine? That only proves my point even further. Despite the fact that it's an organization he has EXTENSIVE knowledge of, the only times he sees fit using that mighty "Intelligence" is when it comes to tormenting one person.

[Guest thanosisawesome]

Actually, if you actually read, before butting in like some idiot, he's the one who made the claim first without any evidence. So, if anything, the burden's on him. The only "proof" he had was this very debate. Heads up, it doesn't work like that. You can't use the current contention as evidence for the claim. That's like someone on trial for murder for killing a store owner, and the prosecutor says that he has the capability to commit murder because he committed murder in killing the store owner.

 

Not that it changes the point of my rant at all, but I was under the impression that he used the codes to dig up files on Wolverine, and that was the hacking. Also, how are the only times Creed hacks into the Weapon X databases solely to get information on Wolverine? That only proves my point even further. Despite the fact that it's an organization he has EXTENSIVE knowledge of, the only times he sees fit using that mighty "Intelligence" is when it comes to tormenting one person.

His claim wasn't made without any evidence. This very debate should be proof enough, since one side has used evidence while the other has used none. That's a terrible analogy. It's more like a man was caught red handed murdering the store owner, with multiple eyewitnesses. Since you presented no past incidences when questioned, it would be safe to assume none exist.

 

But anyways, that's enough, I'll let you go at it.

[Guest force_echo]

His claim wasn't made without any evidence. This very debate should be proof enough, since one side has used evidence while the other has used none. That's a terrible analogy. It's more like a man was caught red handed murdering the store owner, with multiple eyewitnesses. Since you presented no past incidences when questioned, it would be safe to assume none exist.

 

But anyways, that's enough, I'll let you go at it.

Really? I've used no evidence? So that whole response on the last page doesn't exist? That's why Kain basically admitted that he couldn't find strategic instances of Sabretooth actually fighting that don't involve him specifically messing with Wolverine. And FYI, he didn't produce any past incidents either. I'm debating with retards that can't even understand basic logic. Then, when they're told that they don't make any sense, they either stop debating or say something to the effect of "You're so stupid I don't have to debate with you" or "that's enough, I'll let you go at it". If you wanted to let me go at it, you should have just kept your ignorance to yourself.

[Guest thanosisawesome]

Really? I've used no evidence? So that whole response on the last page doesn't exist? That's why Kain basically admitted that he couldn't find strategic instances of Sabretooth actually fighting that don't involve him specifically messing with Wolverine. And FYI, he didn't produce any past incidents either. I'm debating with retards that can't even understand basic logic. Then, when they're told that they don't make any sense, they either stop debating or say something to the effect of "You're so stupid I don't have to debate with you" or "that's enough, I'll let you go at it". If you wanted to let me go at it, you should have just kept your ignorance to yourself.

Whatever you say. I probably shouldn't have said anything anyway.

[xLEGACYx]

in the end, it is pointless to debate with echo.  Either he will keep using his opinion to say you are wrong or just blatantly say the same thing over and over until you get to the same point everyone normally does.  Let him believe what he wants because its just a waste of time to debate.  He really just gets on peoples nerves.  You cant win even when you prove him wrong in multiple facets. 

 

So good luck continuing with him thanosisawesome.

[Guest thanosisawesome]

in the end, it is pointless to debate with echo.  Either he will keep using his opinion to say you are wrong or just blatantly say the same thing over and over until you get to the same point everyone normally does.  Let him believe what he wants because its just a waste of time to debate.  He really just gets on peoples nerves.  You cant win even when you prove him wrong in multiple facets. 

 

So good luck continuing with him thanosisawesome.

Yeah, I know.